The beauty of planning, and why we should love the process by Jonbo
The “process” or the “project”, however you want to call it, has come in for some flack, but I feel that’s because we are unable to disconnect from how the results are going.
Obviously, results, signings and a manager/club’s vision are intertwined. If results are bad, we blame the manager, the process, the club, but that isn’t always fair. Just look at Man Utd as a great example. Almost every manager since Fergie has struggled because of a lack of planning, and understanding about the club, its needs, and vision.
In the short term it’s easy to blame the likes of Ole, Mourinho, Van Gaal, etc, but over the long-term we’ve seen it’s actually very poor planning from the hierarchy at the club that has cost them. Utd have outspent everyone in England yet are a million miles off the likes of City and Liverpool because there’s been no planning. Now they are in the same mess or worse that we were in not so long ago.
Now Arteta may or may not be the right man to get the best out of our squad, but what I love about him is that, along with the club, he has very clear vision, and on the whole, the planning has been excellent.
It’s very important that the club continues this whenever Arteta goes, so that our next manager has the best chance to succeed. If you fail to Plan, you are planning to fail! This was something we saw EVERY season under Wenger and Gazidis. We don’t want to go back to those days!
They never did squad assessments, so they never addressed our weakest areas. Last minute signings that were only brought in to appease the fans, and strengthening our strongest areas, as we did with Ozil, was why we were a complete mess.
Things didn’t improve that much under Raul and Mislintat, but I feel now everyone is working in the proper way. We actually do squad assessments now! So it’s important that the club is consistent with this for future managers.
Now we understand the beauty of planning, why should we love the current process? Whilst a club’s planning needs to be consistent, a process can be interchangeable depending on a manager’s specific vision, and I like what I am seeing at the moment.
Since Arteta’s arrival, we’ve been getting players in with Premier League experience which was something we were not doing enough of in the past. This means far less risk when spending big, because you know the player has already adapted to the league, and the EPL is the toughest league in the world, maybe only second to the Championship.
I love the age profile as well. Not only could we get many years from these players, but it also makes great business sense with their sell-on value, and being able to better reinvest. We do need a little more quality experience, which we seem to be addressing this summer, but even then, it seems to be players in their mid-twenties, and not huge names, which I think is perfect.
The problem you sometimes get with a huge name, inevitably on that huge salary, is a lack of motivation. Almost a sense that they’re bigger than the club, and they don’t have to work that hard. We saw it with Ozil, and Pogba, and you see it with Neymar as well.
All our players, and the ones we’re linked to, have something to prove. They have that motivation. Even with Jesus, who we’ve just signed. One could say it’s a step down from City playing for Arsenal, but Jesus still has a lot to prove. He wasn’t a regular, often played out of position, but now he has a great opportunity to prove his worth as a striker.
I also like this British/South American alignment forming at Arsenal. We all love any British/English player, especially young players coming through the ranks. It seems to build a stronger connection between the players, the fans, and the club. Then we have the South American contingent at Arsenal, which may have more to do with Edu and his connections.
Not always, but part of a South American player’s makeup usually consists of a strong work ethic, aggression, tenacity, stylish play, and knowing the dark arts of the game. Just imagine if we can get multiple players at the same time performing like Alexis was.
So whether you like Arteta or not, or even Edu and others in the hierarchy, I feel we now plan properly. We have a vision. We’re not completely there yet in regards to having all processes in place.
The running down of contracts is yet to be fully resolved, and I would like to see the club be more demanding of good results, meaning less patience with players and managers, and even those in the hierarchy.
I fully understand, and agree with giving Arteta and Edu, and others, plenty of time given the complete mess they inherited, but now that we more or less have stability once again, I would like to see everyone under a bit more pressure to perform.
Jonbo
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Fine words but the “complete mess” he inherited that got and played in Europe, won Fa cups and finished in the same or higher than under Arteta is still a “complete mess” until they prove otherwise. Highest spenders in europe last year and spending big this year, isn’t what Arsenal are known for, so unless there is immediate improvement next season, the “complete mess” can not be said to have been sorted. Proof is what is required!!!!!!
Absolutely correct Reggie.
This article is wishful thinking unless MA gets back to finishing in the top four, competing in THE KO stages of the CL and winning fa cups.
The complete mess of giving players away and then paying for the privilege, is conveniently not mentioned, as is the failure to qualify for ANY level of european football for the first time in two decades.
If one REALLY wants to be objective when comparing situations, then it should be made in a constructive way.
I wonder why, for instance, Aubemeyang wasn’t mentioned along with the other players on high salaries?
Could it be that it was Arteta who agreed the £300,000 plus salary, even after dealing firsthand with the Ozil debacle?
Certainly no lessons learnt there I suggest!
At the moment, we are like spud fans, thinking that success is just around the corner.
Let’s hope the optimism doesn’t prove to be a false dawn and MA can take us back to the promised land of top four, attacking football and Cup wins.
Fingers crossed 🤞🤞🤞
Ken all i have ever asked for is improvement, not false dawns. The biggest false dawn in the last three years was only one month ago. THROWING AWAY TOP FOUR, to all teams Spuds. Now years ago that would have been a sacking but people accepted it because it got us into the EL. How expectations and ideals have fallen. I am sorry, i am fed up to the back teeth of false futures.
Ken in my post below, I clearly stated I don’t want top 4. I want to see heart, desire, passion and will to win in the way we play. I don’t want us to lose 13 matches again. That is what I will measure the the progress with. We are acquiring some good players just like we did when we got Pepe, Mateo, Torreria and Saliba but what we do with them in terms of how we develop them, make them better and utilize their skillset to grow as a club is what I’m looking at first. We can’t win the league and if we are progressing I want to see us go toe to toe with Manchester city, liverpool and I don’t want to see us losing embarrassingly to the likes of Palace, Brighton and other small clubs. If Brighton can beat spurs, draw with liverpool we should be able to do that.
I agree that as things stand, we are not able to compete with the likes of city, liverpool and chelsea for the PL.
The winning of the PL is not what I will judge Mikel on either, as I didn’t with the two previous managers.
I want to see consistency, passion, flowing and attacking football that gets me out of my seat and applauding Mikel and his players.
If he achieves those goals,, a top four finish and a fa cup win every so often, and CL KO stages, then he will have been a total success in my eyes.
It seems you and I have both got realistic hopes for the coming season Adiva!!
👍👍
Agree. Essentially. He cannot fail this season. The excuses are gone with how much we are spending. And don’t even wanna think about what cleaning up this mess would be like if some of these big purchases flop. I will stay positive and hope for the best this season tho.
Quote right Reggie. The complete mess at our club have been under Arteta not before. Here we have a clear case of someone who has openly put the club below the manager. What kit colour does Arteta FC have Jonbo?
@HH
Sorry but i have to take issue again with the statement “The complete mess at our club have been under Arteta not before.”
Not my opinion, but I will simply quote a Sky Sports report on the day Emery was sacked…
Arsenal have sacked head coach Unai Emery after the club’s worst run of results since 1992.
Arsenal are without a win in their last seven matches following Thursday’s 2-1 defeat to Eintracht Frankfurt in the Europa League. The Gunners have won only four of their 13 Premier League games this season and are now eighth, eight points adrift of the Champions League places.
Was that not a little bit of a mess?
Yes it was but the big majority of those players had just the previous season finished 4th and lost a final of the EL. I believe the “mess” was not as bad as portrayed. I think a manager just needed to come in and realign what was wrong. We had a strike force costing 175 mil and had been banging goals in. Over the next 3 seasons that strike force was firing blanks, it shouldn’t have been. We let two go for nothing and one now we cant give away. Where is the good planning in that?
Sorry 5th the season before.
We all agree but how did we finish that year and the next? Arteta had spending power and no Europe so in my opinion arteta is growing but still a novice
Didn’t Arteta went on to have one of the worst runs in club’s history?
And we all know what happened under Emery. It was nothing to do with player’s quality or lack of planning.
The same players had gone on a 22 unbeated run the previous season so where is the lack of planning in that?
And the writer says the mess started under Wenger. What mess were we in under the great manager?
Instead of trying to sell us the process by attacking the previous management with false news and twisted information why doesn’t he try to convince us to believe the process? Is it that he can’t find any?
AFC has been in perpetual decline for years (almost 2 decades). At some point it was going to reach rock bottom(complete mess). It is my opinion that NO manager could have arrested that in 2 seasons..
Yes it was never been. We never finished 8 twice or lost 13 matches in two consecutive season. You are saying…… Wenger last 10 years was worst according to you and Arteta 3 years are the best after that but Arteta has never achieved half of Wenger achieved in his worst years. I don’t hate Arteta but I dislike being lied to about Arteta’s abstract success. I want him to succeed because if he does my club does.
“You are saying…… Wenger last 10 years was worst according to you and Arteta 3 years are the best ”
Did you read my comment? Do you understand what ” decline” means?
Also the number of negative records set under Arteta, he amassed several as I remember.
No one expected Arteta to be better than Wenger, but certainly an improvement over Emery.
Emery also had a 22 game undefeated streak, hopefully Arteta can match or exceed that streak.
Admin Pat, it doesnt help when the players down tools, the head coach has had little say in bringing those players to the Club and the Board fails to support the head coach in disciplining those players.
@Reggie
So Arsenal was a really well run club, with the correct mentality, culture and ambition when Arteta arrived?
Arsenal were a competitive club both home and abroad when he joined?
And the squad he inherited was full of high valued quality players, that were all united in unison?
And all 3 of the above have been PUT right? And we are now planning, when we were not before. Tell me what proof have you that we are now planning, when we were not before.
Until he proves it, you or i can not say we are now planning and getting results. When he or the club do get physical results, we can have a proper conversation about how it succeeded.
As we prepare for the season I would have loved some shake up in the backroom too. That set peace specialist worked wonders last season, having more experts in specific fields would be an added advantage for Mikel. The striking/ finishing positions needs some help even with the new profile of players coming in.
Bringing in ex players / legends on tour to help teach the new bunch would be nice (Campbell for defense, Rosisky and Gilberto for midfield, Kanu for strikers, Arsene, yes Arsene for the coaching staff and showing them hour the beautiful game has to be played). All these would bring the feel good factor and extra boost as we start a tricky season with the World Cup mid-season.
I’m glad Arsenal dan their management are on the same page. Even if Arteta and Edu should leave for whatever reasons, the young players have been trained for positional play and can easily be sold without losing much of their values for the next management regime
Man United almost had the plan with Solskjaer, before their board ruined it by signing their old legend for financial purposes. I guess that’s why Kroenke didn’t spend as much when he still had to listen to the other stakeholders’ inputs
I think most Arteta’s/ Edu’s players have better work ethics and stamina than their predecessors, due to their ages and non-celeb status. I expect more intense high press from our attackers and midfielders next season, which hopefully could ease the jobs of our defenders
First of all, there are too more important giving to EPL experience.
Now doubt, it has it advantage and it’s less risky compare to others , but I can’t tell you it doesn’t guaranteed any success.
Lukaku and grealish were EPL proven. Costing their team 200m. That would build and entire team of non EPL experience and who could challenge any EPL experience team if spent well.
Liverpool Diaz and nunuez are not EPL proven, and Diaz seems to have done great in his short time.
Salah and DaBruyne were deemed not good enough for the prem initially. Its about ethics and knowledge building a team, not where or what they have come from.
Also right players for the right system.
Jesus will be fine under Arteta, he presses and 10-15 PL goals a year. Auba not tasked with defending can score 20 or more goals as his career shows. Look at him under Wenger and Emery.
It’s fine if Arteta wants his strikers tracking back and defending outside our box. However, highly unlikely that striker is scoring 20 or more goals. It doesn’t happen using those defensive tactics, look at all our strikers goals last 2 1/2 years.
I don’t remember it that way. DB was seen as a great signing when he arrived at City.
Back then £55m was a lot and people at other clubs were unhappy that they were losing out.
He meant when they were both at Chelsea.
Grealish did well last season. Just not worth the absurd price tag was the main problem. Lukaku just gave up 1 month into signing for Chelsea. That came down to attitude.
He won the league.
Mustafi won the World Cup
How right you are but if memory serves me right he didn’t play in the semi or final.
Fact remains he won the world cup..just like Grealish won the league (as you correctly stated) but didnt mention that City would most likely have won the league anyway without him..
He did from the bench but Grealish did play regularly and contributed. Not that im that bothered about either too be honest. And comparing Grealish winning a league to Mustaffi winning the world cup is a bit strange. Grealish in my view will be a success but again, im not too bothered if he isnt, unless its for us of course.
Not a reply to anyone in particular but to all on the comments about Grealish winning the league. He didn’t win it, the team he played in did and would have probably won the league without him.
Exactly.
I agree, this season is massive for arsenal and arteta, if we don’t make top 4 this time questions will have to be asked. I’m very worried that we don’t seem to be in for another striker after signing Jesus. We need another too striker this season to be sure of a top four finish imo. Last season was a real disappointment in the end we shouldn’t have give that 4th place up, no way and if the player have the drive and fight your talking about we wouldn’t have. We are better now than when arteta took over but now is the time to go and prove it by winning g in Europe and getting a top four or higher finish. I just don’t think Jesus and Eddie are enough we need another top striker for sure.
Jesus will improve the chances that get created for our wide players. He’s great at bringing players into the game, and he will get good chances to score as well. I had same fears but thinking it over more I like the buy. It’s funny that we go for a false 9 leading the line, the same season both Liverpool and City get traditional big No 9.’s tho
Im pleased we have signed Jesus but as a no9? His goals per minute played in the prem are actually pretty good but as a note of caution, behind Pierre Emerick Aubameyang. Apparently the reason we got him above other teams is we have promised him, he will lead the line. Big call, i really hope it works.
@Bob IMO we don’t need another striker but rather a Winger, reason why I love the links with Raphinha. Gabriel will get us goals next season.
Our Gabriel’s already do get us goals😊
How Jonbo can claim that there was no squad assesments during AW and Emery is beyond me!can he back those claims with facts?
He then adds that under MA , we do now have it/them.well MA has been at the helm of the team for close to 3 years,how come that he still hasn’t addressed our obvious need for a proper DM?a criticism constantly aimed at AW,at least Emery tried to,he got Torreira who wasn’t his first choice, alongside TP Emery wanted Nzonzi.
Correct, how did the assessment of giving away a record breaking striker and bringing in nobody worked.
Reggie, that actually makes things much worse,after MA “assessed” his squad in December/January,he decided that after getting rid of players,we(or should I say “he”)didn’t need anyone and still get top 4.if that’s the case,I find it worrying.
But people dont like the truth, they like to hope and dream.
@Reggie,
Do you think Arteta had any choice but to let Aubameyang go after he drove to Barcelona on his own back and parked outside the Camp Nou?
He had a choice not to replace him completely.
@Reggie,
That was a bit difficult considering it was DEadline Day matey….
No it wasn’t, it was going on weeks before and the decision to let him go was deadline day. Which contrary to what was said in the article BAD PLANNING. We were actively trying to sign a striker, the problem was we ignored for weeks the FACT, he didn’t want to come to us. Now where is tge planning in that. What top club runs its business like that.
The reason was that there were 17 games to go and only the PL left to play for.
Buying in Jan is not a good idea, they were not really expecting top 4 last year, so when the chance materialised it was beyond expectations and EL was, in the end, the target which was achieved.
Some people seem to think you can just conjure a top striker up out of thin air, no need to worry about cost or availability.
In reality the loss of Partey and Tierney to injury probably cost more than any recruitment issues.
The focus last season was to continue clearing out the dead wood, ready for this window – buying a striker in a panic was not the way to do that.
If someone likes the way this window is going, it’s important to see how the ground was prepared in the previous two.
We were actively trying to buy a striker in January, one who didn’t want to come right from the start. To get rid of our striker (one who helped his team into CL qualifying with his goals) without a replacement was not good planning.
@IDWIC
Isn’t the fact we didn’t and still don’t have adequate back ups for partey and tierney as well as not signing a CF in January the same issue?
@ Palmer
A squad rebuild doesn’t happen overnight.
Getting to a place where you have 2 good players of roughly equal ability in every position is not easy and was certainly not achievable in the time available.
A club that’s not in Europe does not have the luxury of signing good players whenever they feel like it and with 17 games to go…
Remember that this was a tme when the club was desperately trying to offload dead weight players – buying more was not a sensible option especially since, to repeat yet another thing I said already… top 4 was not seen as a realistic target last season (with good reason).
I don’t recognise anything factual in your assertion – and it is just anotyher assertion – I saw no evidence of Arsenal trying to buy a striker in January.
I distinctly recall the criticism of not trying to do so.
We physically put a bid in for Vlahavic.
I distinctly remember us chasing him for three weeks.
My recollection is that he was only interested in Juventus so it never got to the point of offer.
To bigger clubs – in fact to most clubs – January is not a time to do anything unless you can get something that you’d buy anyway. He fitted that bill, didn’t want to come here, went to Juventus. End of story.
KEY POINT: There’s a world of difference between going after one player who seems to be a good fit, just because he’s available in Jan, and what you said which was (copy/pasted):
“We were actively trying to buy a striker in January”
Which implies shopping around, considering many options.
I’m not saying a squad rebuild happens overnight I agree with some of what you say but you originally stated that the loss of tierney and partey cost us more and my reply was meaning that if we had strengthened in January where we were lacking and maybe thought ahead regarding injuries then we maybe wouldn’t have blown 4th the way we did. Hence I said about getting a CF in January and the injuries we ended up having being the same thing. As in we didn’t do anything in January and just hoped what we had was enough. Which in truth clearly wasn’t enough as we blew 4th pathetically. And if I remember the two players from Juve that spurs got we were linked with and could’ve been the difference
He has inside knowledge as a head of PR department.
👍👍👍
How do you want fans that have different opinions to yours respond to your words like the …big mess he inherited… You and others accused fans of being negative but you are negative yourself about previous regimes that did arguably better than Arteta. If you want to support Arteta wholeheartedly please do but stop dragging down our previous manager. Arteta bringing new players doesn’t amount to anything now until we see what he can achieve the players. The mess got him fa cup and CS. Let see what these bunch of good qualities players ( have never seen our squad not been good enough under him) achieve with him. At least they can start by not losing 13 matches next season and as far as I’m concerned I don’t care where they finish since they can’t win the league. i just don’t want to see us lose 13 matches next season with the most dare football I have seen in my football watching life.
Contrary to certain peoples accusations, when the whistle blows, i want Arsenal to win that game. Now if that isnt supporting Arteta because im supporting Arsenal, i dont know what is. Its not the managers name, its the result. Its logical that if you are losing games, you are getting flack, if you are winning games you aren’t. If i didn’t support Arteta, i would want us to lose. That doesn’t mean i cant complain about his ways in between. When wenger was winning the league, i never complained, when he wasn’t i really did. Its the managers job to keep EVERYONE happy.
Absolutely agree with Reggie and post is in support of post above. Arteta has not done considerable close to what Wenger did in his bad years yet we keep getting he left a mess. A mess that won Arteta FA cup. Let him achieve him something worth bragging about with other fans before we all these praise. He is trying no doubt about that but it’s not beyond that. Emery would have done the same or better if he is supported and helped like our current coah.
Hallelujah!!!!!🤣🤣🤣🤣 thats correct.
👍👍 How would Mikel Arteta have gone at Villarreal? How much did they spend to win the Europa League and make the final of the Champions League under manager Unai Emery?
Adiva is spot on!it seems that the people who label fans ‘negative” for criticising/questioning..MA are doing the exact same thing when it comes to our previous managers!! I’m pretty sure there is a word for it…..!!
Hypocrite ?
🎯
Adiva, Terry Neil lost 11 matches as Arsenal manager and was sacked.
I agree with many of the points above. Most damaging was the inability to recruit for areas where the team was weak, instead we just seemed to buy any big name who was available. Also we must accept that every player has a sell by date, so after a few years we must maximise the profit on a player, sell for a high price and then start all over. Nobody lasts for ever in this game. If only we had sold e.g. Wilshere and Walcott at their peak.
You have just described the current management.
NOTHING HAS COME TO FRUITION UNTIL HE ACHIEVE SOMETHING WITH HIS OWN PLAYERS NOT WENGER’S PLAYERS!
8TH, 8TH, AND GIFTING AWAY 4TH IS NOT FRUITS.
GETTING KNOCKED OUT EALRY IN CUPS BY CHAMPIONSHIP SIDES IS NOT FRUITS!
HOW CAN YOU SPOUT ALL THESE NONSENSE!
WRITE THIS ARTICLE AGAIN NEXT JUNE IF WE HAVE ACTUALLY ACHIEVED SOMETHING.
AND NO QUALIFYING FOR EUROPA LEAGUE DOES NOT COUNT!
Agree, let actually achieve something first and then CROW ABOUT IT.
@HH
Small point of order. The headline says “coming to fruition” NOT “come to fruition”.
And as I don’t know if you actually read the article or just the headline, but Jonbo makes it clear we are not the finished product. He wrote…. “So whether you like Arteta or not, or even Edu and others in the hierarchy, I feel we now plan properly. We have a vision. We’re not completely there yet in regards to having all processes in place.”
And I must say I’m not used to you scarily using CAPITALS for a whole comment! Having a bad day?
The headline contradicts the article.
@Reggie
LOL it doesn’t but I will refrain from continuing as you are refusing to accept the quote from the article that backed up the headline.
Please cheer up and have a nice day y’all!
Note from the article ” now we understand the beauty of planning” sorry but contrary to what you are insinuating, the article is suggesting we have it all right now and we are planning now when we were not before.
Okay then fine Pat.
I would like the writer to defend the following statement with evidence if there is any.
“They never did squad assessments, so they never addressed our weakest areas.”
And how has our weakest areas been addressed when under Arteta the team has been scoring less while conceding more than previous teams and it has reflected on our results?
I don’t remember under Wenger or Emery for Arsenal to be in one competition only after just half a season and failing to achieve the minimum even after having a big lead up to the last games.
Winking the EL or finishing 4th should be this seasons target
For me Arsenal are yet to solve the big problem that cost us top four, Full bag 2 and 3 to cover Tieny and Tomyassu is what priosrity signing Arteta must doing. In midfield I don’t trust Perty he is in and out due to enjaries go for Tielemans.Fabion signing is good he can cover Odigaard ,In the wing no need to sell pepe give him game time to cover saka, let Smith Row and martternell play on the left wing,In forward Jesus, Gnabry and Nketia.As for backline Saliba, Gabby,white, Holding,Tomyassu Tieny, Martinez from Ajax and
a Rightbag
I’m not sure you can say the new players have the motivation? That has to be proved, and not over the first few months but over a year or two at least.
True, where was the motivation the last 3 games when we were 4 points ahead of spuds?
That “motivation” saw us played off the pitch by spuds, well cooked at halftime.
Where was the “motivation” against Newcastle? They looked like the team playing for 4th didn’t they?
None feared being benched, 4th wasn’t a requirement as previously, and Arteta knew his was safe after signing extension, so where was the motivation?
Durand 👍. Tottenham, Crystal Palace, Brighton, Southampton and Newcastle, the players did not turn up for the Arsenal.
And Pat would I be wrong to accuse the writer of fake news and deliberate misinformation when he claims since Arteta arrived we have been signing players with premier league experience when of the 15-16 players he has signed only 4 are from the premier league? And only two of them are starters?
I was going to write something similar but i dint think that matters too much, what matters is if the player is successful. But we have signed a lot of players without prem experience under Arteta.
Shifting goalposts are what’s different.
1. Have they mentioned goals for upcoming season?
2. How players or manager will be judged?
3. Defined “progress?”
4. When is the “process” expected to be complete? Top 4? PL title?
5. What signals the end of the rebuild?
Club has wisely avoided any concrete statements and avoided committing to any standards to determine success or failure.
Perhaps they learned that after Wenger and Emery, so virtually anything can be called “success” under this “process” because there are no standards to be judged by.
To be fair to little jimmy krankie, he says they want to win the league and get us back to where we were.
Which club publishes those details?
Arsenal does, the only club I care about.
Remember when Wenger was reminded “top 4 or else?” What happened after he finished 5th and 6th?
Emery when he took the job, lost Europa finals, finished 5th, and was in 9th when he was sacked.
Mysteriously the last 2 1/2 years not a peep about that or anything of substance oddly enough. Now anything can be claimed as “success.”
8th and out of Europe was called “progress” last year, choking 4th when it was in our hands.
You see, too many say “reached 5th” rather than “lost 4th” when we controlled our fate.
Better to control the narrative when you don’t commit to goals or standards.
They don’t PUBLISH them (into the public domain). People SURMISE what they might be.
Your assertions don’t make something true.
No, I get them from Quotes from Josh Kroenke, Arsene Wenger, and Emery. Even Ivan Gazidis when he spoke to media.
But hey, believe what you want, I only base it on research.
Utter tosh. People in charge of clubs don’t run around saying “If he doesn’t get top 4 he’s out” in any place that the public could hear them.
Please link a credible source of your assertions. Emphasis on “credible”.
What this article actually proves, is that there are supporters out there, who ask legitimate questions, while STILL supporting the club.
We are not, as some would like to class us, negative supporters – we see what is / has happened and simply question it.
We are also tired of the usage by which everyone but Mikel is responsible for all the ills since he took over.
What I find most ridiculous is that we are told we are not supporting the club….so what were fans doing when they were questioning AW and UE?
We all want success and I’m certain that if MA brings it, everyone will be over the moon, just as we were when he won the fa cup.
I am heartened by the fact that so many of us will not be browbeaten into remaining silent – let’s keep judging Mikel in the same way as we did Arsene and Unai.
Referring to your last sentence ken, some of us do.
Indeed Reggie and we are true supporters of the club, not supporting a person… to parrot yet another silly accusation.
spot on Ken
way too early for any such article…it’s clear that whomever wrote this was simply using the euphoria surrounding the whole TW to rally the MA troops…like they needed a rallying call (lol)
What a dismal read this thread is A fine article but brought down by two particular relentless negative only doomsters, who both refuse to listen to reason.
Certain so called fans get off on doom only and cannot stand anyone being optimistic.
If I writing what I really thought of these particular two, who, between them, are on virtually every third comment on this thread, I would be banned for sure.
I am mightily glad I do not have their doomster attitude towards the club which I DO support and which they claim to support, though NEVER do so, even remotely, in words.
I challenge them both, and they know who they are, to ever say ANYTHING positive about our club. Reckon its beyond both of them.
You make fair points Jon, but some fans merely criticize Arteta’s decisions much as they did with Wenger.
For example, Wenger keeping players not good enough, like Xhaka as you have often commented on, still here under Arteta.
We need a true DM, something Wenger arrogantly ignored, and Arteta has as well in 2 1/2 years. That may change if he brings in a DM this window to be part of the starting 11.
Or adding yet another CAM in Fabio, when we already have Odegaard, ESR, and Patino coming up. It reminds me of Wenger’s obsession with CAMs and playing them out of position. Is that Arteta’s plan, or have a 34 million player sit on the bench?
Or ESR sit on the bench and rot now with the new addition? They can’t develop without game time. ESR had double digit goals and has earned a chance to compete, not take a backseat to Fabio.
We still lack a plan B for striker, something we need with our crossing style of play. We are chasing another Winger instead, although still time for a plan B this window.
It’s questioning these decisions is all many are doing, not bashing Arteta.
You are an intelligent man and can identify the difference between doomsters and fair criticism. We all want Arsenal to be successful whether Wenger, Emery, or Arteta manages.
No one should get a free pass or be beyond reproach. We all remember how that turned out with Wenger in charge and the damage it caused. We merely don’t want that repeated and think questioning and criticizing doesn’t disqualify one as a fan or supporter.
NO DISAGREEMENT WITH FANS BEING ABLE TO CRITICISE MA. But certain fans criticise on EVERY single thing ever MA does or does not do and NEVER, SAY ANYTHING AT ALL POSITIVE .
THAT was my whole point and not about merely complaining at criticism, at times.
But when its ALWAYS so and relentlessly too, then there is a clear and obvious as your nose on you face AGENDA!
And that is an odd attitude to take for anyone claiming to be a real supporter.
As it seems you disagree, then fair enough, but that is MY view anyway.
I don’t disagree at all Jon, we actually agreed much of the time when Wenger and Emery managed.
We had similar opinions in our postings regarding players, tactics, substitutions, and fielding players out of position.
Even now we both criticize Arteta for retaining Xhaka when he clearly isn’t suited to the squad.
I have praised Arteta when he earned it, and criticized him for the same reason.
Again I don’t disagree with your opinion or statement, and you did not generalize in your comment.
I guess the whole “not a fan or supporter” accusation by many is tiresome to me. Would it be fair to accuse others of “double standard fans” or “Arteta before Arsenal fans” because he is excused or exempted from results when others were not?
He’s had the money, control, and backing Emery never received, as well as exemptions.
I hope Arteta is successful for the sake of Arsenal, but so far he’s spent around 310 million (and counting) to finish where Emery did with deadwood.
👍Spot on, Durand. Jon needs to reread has past posts regarding Arsene Wenger and Unai Emery.
Jon it’s the reason why I don’t come on JA as much as I used to. Its just moaning, whinging, relentless negative comments. There is bias within parts of the readership that would prefer to be proven correct than to see a successful Arsenal.
I agree Jon, there are some really irritating accounts here who are the kind of “supporters” that, frankly, Arsenal would be better off without.
I don’t see them actually supporting anything the club is doing. If that’s their best effort at support, I hope they’ll go and “support” someone else.
‘The Process’…..an excuse for when things are not working….call it ‘the process’, then when we lose three on the trot to bog standard sides and throw the’Champions League’ away, then we can say it’s OK its ‘the process’. ‘The Process’ is a cop out.
Just as it was a dismal read when our two previous managers were in situ.
AW wasn’t blamed if the hot dogs were cold and expensive, while UE was blamed for “buying” the wrong players.
Day after day, week after week, right back to 2008 these doom and gloom merchants were calling out these two guys, yet get “depressed” because Mikel is being held to the same scrutiny?!?!
What goes around comes around suits this situation to a T.
👍
👍 “buying the wrong players” when he was head coach, had no say in transfers, didnt get the players he asked for (Partey and Zaha being examples) and was expected to coach those bought in by others and had player discipline undermined by the Board.
I just hope Arteta stays calm and continues trying to improve himself, the team and the club as a whole. There seems to be a sense of optimism since he joined as manager..
I just hope that he keeps his head down. Just ignore the pessimists, doomsters, the 24/7 negativity merchants and those that have these personal grudges are against him.
It’s going to be a serious next season. Want to see more progress, much better / entertaining football, getting points off the likes of City and Liverpool, a comfortbale finish in the Top 4. No more just about sneaking in there..
No more excuses. He has been backed financially, been backed over any player, the club has absolutely given near full authority. Now he has to repay back the loyalty and leeway the club and majority of our fanbase have afforded him.
Agree with that!!!!!!!
👍👍For Arsenal to be a success Mikel Arteta, Edu, the Board and players must be successful. Every part of the organization must reach optimal performance given the constraints.
There seems to be no-one who realises that football has changed radically since 2004.
Top 4 is becoming MUCH harder with the crazy bankrolling of so many clubs now. With Newcastle now owned by a country with oil money coming out of its ears, Chelsea built up by an oligarch etc etc, just getting past City, ‘pool and the other two suspects is hard enough let alone Spurs and others who are under-performing for their bankroll like Leicester and Everton.
Every discussion about objectives HAS to take account of that simple fact of modern PL football life.
But it never does. All I ever see from the doomsters is “Lots of cash spent, manager must achieve top 4 or he’s out”.
Good luck with that, I suspect you may be repeating it for the next 30 years.
If football has changed since 2004 why is Arteta excused when Emery and Wenger weren’t?
Oh HH, dont be so matter of fact.🙂
I was going to ask you politely if you ever have anything worth reading to input, but I suppose the new and sensible rules being what they are I should just continue to ignore you and your other accounts.
I said nothing about excusing anyone. If Arteta achieves less and keeps his job then it might be because it’s much more difficult now. Surely that was completely obvious from what I wrote?
You and your other accounts seem desperate to find an Arteta-bashing argument in everything.
For the avoiudance of doubt, I have no strong feelings on Arteta either way – I was disappointed to see Emery leave and even more so with Wenger, who I thought did a great job during the stadium rebuild years, as I’ve said here before.
However, any or all of those would struggle to compete with the financing of PL clubs these days.
The above was directed at the HH post btw.
For someone who doesn’t care, you sure got a lot to say defending your boy.
Tell me what is the process?
The highest spending club not involved in Europe yet missed CL again. FFS, we just needed 4pts from our last 4 games and he f…d it up like being knocked out of our domestic cups in spectacular fashion.
There is no recognisable style , at least Wenger played attacking football till the last 2 years, Emery had a style albeit a counter style. What is our novice’s play? Counter? We sold auba, Press? Not organised especially with a dud like xhaka in midfield. We can’t defend a lead and we always allow teams to come back by switching off after scoring. There is no urgency to score more goals till its too late. We start slow in games we need to win then he doesn’t know how to play when they park the bus.
Rejects better/ potential players but keeps his dud favourites , xhaka…anyone, nketiah on a higher salary…
A mediocre and uninspiring captain who has transported his thoughts to management. Sadly like the Hull FA win, his FA win has extended the true Arsenal fans agony.
I don’t fully blame the krooenkes, they have spent. I blame them for the board we have, who hired edu and the novice when there were better alternatives. Stan now has 3 major trophy’s, let’s hope he decides he really wants one from across the ditch.
I didn’t defend anyone. Read it again, more carefully this time.
“This was something we saw EVERY season under Wenger and Gazidis. We don’t want to go back to those days!”
What the days when we played football the right way and competed in the CL
Yep I don’t want to go back to those days either .
Haha well said DK
I am a simple man.
All I want for next season is:
To finish above Spurs and to qualify for the Champions League.
I don’t give a tinker’s cuss what has gone before, I am just looking forward to next season.
However, I will reiterate my belief that, if the 4 players we have brought in so far had been available to Arteta when we played that away game against Spurs, we would still have lost. I think these new players are icing on a cake that has some serious bits missing.
However, there is a while to go before the window closes, and I will feel much more comfortable if:
We have signed a top specialized DM to help Partey, a big man up front to take the pounding and a solid left back to give Tierney some time off.
There should be more willingness to spend on the midfield which is presently our weakest area. I think we require atleast 2 quality midfielders, Partey is continuously injured and Xhaka is unreliable. We need a midfielder who can shield the defence like Fabinho and Rodri and someone who can score and create like Madison or Tielemans.