“Arteta Out”? Can Arsenal fans stop being so fickle for a change?

‘Arteta Out’ Makes Zero Sense by Dan Smith

So I actually haven’t given my opinion of if I’m in the camp of ‘Arteta In’ or ‘Arteta Out’.

First of all let me clarify that last Sunday’s performance against Aston Villa was a disgrace. Forget the result, the performance was unacceptable.

From day one our manager has spoken about the standards of the club and not accepting those who don’t follow those standards. Well everyone associated with the Arsenal has to stress we cannot tolerate an evening like last weekend again. It was that bad. So bad that some of the confidence the players may have felt at the end of last season has evaporated.

Yet even while watching Aston Villa humiliate us. Even being aware that we have one of the ficklest fan bases in the country, I never envisaged that there would be calls for Arteta to be sacked!

As a human experience it’s fascinating.

I don’t know if some gooners just do it for their YouTube Channels or have actually become this reactionary. How can the same readers who told me that Arsenal were title contenders, were winning the Champions League inside three years, that Arteta was better than Pep Guardiola and Wenger, change their minds after 8 games?

This isn’t about me saying ‘I told you so’ but go back to articles in the summer and compare what was being said then to what is being said now. It’s actually scary.

Don’t get me wrong I agree our coach might be too inexperienced, that he was simply a cheap option, so grateful for the job that he was willing to accept limitations (just like Emery).
The difference is that that was my opinion from the day we hired him. Common sense said that an assistant manager wouldn’t be first choice on your short list.

The Arsenal job should attract anyone in the world. Yet an Allegri is only taking the post if he believes it’s realistic to be a champion. 10 minutes into an interview any high-profile name would see the lack of ambition.

When I tried to say this, I was dismissed, called negative, etc. Yet – own your opinions. We can’t keep every week going between the two extremes.

I actually think we may have stumbled on someone special in Arteta, but I fear he won’t get the time to build what he wants. This is why I tried to dismiss any talk of a title bid. You could see what was going to happen a mile off.

Unrealistic expectations putting unfair pressure on the Spaniard, meaning fans get angry when they realize (shock) this team is not as good as they think.

I won’t demand Arteta be sacked, because I had prepared my mind that to get back to our old levels we have to go through many lows. If you finish 8th, that to me means you’re an inconsistent team, So why be shocked if in the next campaign we remain inconsistent?

I also think it would be so unfair to hire someone you know has zero experience, and then sack him a year later for having zero experience.

Our recruitment team must have realised that they were appointing a man who would learn on the job.

Maybe lockdown has made it seem longer, but the poor bloke hasn’t even had 12 months as a manager yet. He’s in his rookie year yet let’s sack him because he’s a rookie.

Then, take the emotion out of it and just be practical. What would happen if we did make a change? Do you think the criteria for the position would change?

It’s been proved since Mr Wenger left, established names don’t want to work under the current model. So you just replace one gamble with another one. Someone so grateful for the high-profile job they nod and smile. They accept only loans in January and slashing the wage bill.

That’s why I maintain while Stan Kroenke is in charge, we will never win the League.

If our owner wanted to, he could have got an Allegri and give 200 million to rebuild the squad
So I guess my attitude is, if I don’t think we will win title under Mr Kroenke anyway, we may just as well see how the Arteta experiment works?

I’m just going to ask though. From now to the Leeds game decide what your opinion is. If your point of view is, you want Arteta out please don’t flip flop if we get 3 points at Elland Road.

Alternatively if you spent the summer saying Arteta was better than Arsene Wenger you can’t change your thinking after 4 defeats, however painful.

That’s why our fan base have become a laughing stock.

Be Kind In The Comments

Dan Smith

Tags Arsenal fans Arteta

106 Comments

  1. val says:

    our fan base in general is not just a laughing stock but arguable the most toxic there is in world football.

    I’m a season ticket holder and attend 99% of all home games and maybe 25-30% of away games and the stadium if someone has a bad game is awful.

    I love going to games, I really do and I spend alot of money each year to do so, but the atmosphere from say 5 years ago till UE got the boot just made me really think long and hard if I wanted to go to the game just because of that.

    Booing our own players, insulting them when they come off is just not acceptable, we as fans are giving the opposition a home game and an extra 60K men on the pitch.

    I hate to think what might happen when we can go back into stadiums

    1. SueP says:

      I’m from a different generation and maybe you are too, and don’t feel in any way entitled like many today. Yes, we had glory years; the first double, the successes of GG followed by the best years of AW, but we did have plenty of lean years in between and I don’t recall the nastiness that has since reared its ugly head in the way you have described and what we have witnessed with planes flying over the Emirates. Perhaps it was the fading after the dominant years with Wenger and the disillusionment that was keenly felt that our new squillionaire owner was not ambitious enough to reach for the top again.
      I just don’t know, but to call for Arteta’s head now is nonsensical and shows that even with an FA Cup and European football this season, that enough fans have no understanding of patience. 11 months plus Covid still with us and it’s ‘get rid’ time already for some. No doubt Arteta has some thinking to do but it is too early to judge in my mind.

    2. Jax says:

      Agreed Val.
      I gave up my season ticket after the third Emirates season due to the crap fans near where I was seated (in the family section would you believe). It regularly made the six hour return journey the most dispiriting, depressing experience of what should have been a really joyous occasion. I’ve been to around 1500 games home & away in my time, so have some great memories and am probably over £1500 per year better off by not going any more so not too fussed about it.
      You don’t get this at WHL!!!

      1. Sue says:

        Wow, I’m surprised at that, Jax. I normally opt for the family enclosure… have sat in most areas, but FE is my fave!

        1. jax says:

          Perhaps I was just unlucky at having some crap (old & young) fans near me.
          I never did like the North Bank at Highbury either.

          1. Sue says:

            Yes, maybe, Jax. Have to admit the only time I sat in lower NB @ the Emirates, I wasn’t that keen…. sorry if anyone on here has a seat there 😄
            Just take pot luck really… or go with what you know!!

    3. val says:

      I’m in my late 50’s SueP

      We have 1! just ! really poor performance and its MA out, we had plenty of really poor performances under Wenger, even during his glory years.

      Liverpool had to wait 30 years to win another title and you never heard nonsense like this from there fan base, that only reared its ugly head when the manager was actually doomed and even then it was just a small minority.

      Jax, I live literally a stones throw from the Emirates, if I dont go to the game i can hear it like its on the telly

      1. Jax says:

        Lucky old you then Val. I’d love to live in one of those Highbury appartments. I’m over 150 miles away now (although much of my life was in North London) so have no physical connections at all anymore.

        1. val says:

          less of the ”old” 😛

          1. Jax says:

            Whoops!😱😈

    4. Mark says:

      “our fan base in general is not just a laughing stock but arguable the most toxic there is in world football.”

      what an over the top statement. Any evidence to back this up or just being?? what the point of asking..you have none..

      1. val says:

        One Eboue coming on as a sub only to literally get booed off.

        nearly 3 years of booing Mustafi, our own player!

        The same sort of time with fans holding up Wenger out signs at every home game.

        Insulting Xaka at home to palace, some of the stuff some fans were yelling at him cannot be repeated.

        You back players that play for your club, period!
        Whether they are playing well or not, they are representing the club.

        That is Toxic and should never have a part in football imo, especially by your own fans, its a disgrace!

      2. Phil says:

        I’m with you Mark. It’s ridiculous to suggest the AFC fanbase is anything other than vocal. We are all entitled to express our feelings. After all the Club belongs to the fans after all. Without the fans there is no club. If the support had not turned on Wenger he would still be manager. If we had not vociferously vented our anger at Emery he would not have followed Wenger in being sacked. It was the fanbase that forced out those two and will ultimately decide how Arteta has his future decided.
        Come up with the goods and he will be worshipped. Fail to deliver and he is out.
        But I would add Arteta had earned the right to have at least two seasons to shape the Club his way. Any less will not give him the time he needs to completely change the team and staff. Any less would be a backward step. And he knows more than anyone that the Villa result and performance will never be accepted again

        1. Zat says:

          My Issue with Arteta is against the teams that seat deep he has failed to come up with a game plan since last season. Arsenal only plays well against teams that attack – the traits of a true mid-table club.

          Laca, Auba, Pepe, Nketiah n Willian are all underperforming. Are they that bad or the tactics don’t favour them????

      3. Dan says:

        Mark it’s an opinion piece ( says in first line )
        None of my opinions are factual that’s why it’s called an opinion

        So to help you ( I assume your young ) if for example someone said like Barnes , ‘ arsenal are too blame for Williams form ‘ there is zero evidence , that’s an opinion

        Hope that helps x

        1. Mark says:

          No Dan ..why would you just assume that I am young? I am 40..have been a supporter since 1996..and I was responding specifically to Val’s comment about “most toxic” in football.. I know of no AFC fans that have crossed the floor to other teams since our decline.. The same cannot be said about Man U fans.. We may mourn but we stick around.. and Dan..I don’t appreciate your condescension.

          1. jon fox says:

            Mark Sorry to have a different perspective but from my standpoint a mere age 40 is virtually a foetus!!

          2. Mark says:

            Ok Mr. dinosaur..we get it..you are milllions of years old..enough already..

          3. Dan says:

            I assumed by you not understanding how a opinion on a fans forum worked and asking for evidence you were young?
            Oops

          4. Mark says:

            Dan I know you arent stupid but you are starting to act that way..As I said I was responding to val.. If you are going to say that AFC fans are the most toxic.. then you have to be able to back that up..with at least examples..to be fair he did give examples afterward.. you however…lets leave this at that..

          5. Mark says:

            and its “an” opinion ..not “a” opinion.. O is a vowel.. seeing that you want to get petty.

          6. Dan says:

            Sorry , your first comment you ended with the following , ‘ what’s the point your asking ( not what the point lol)you have none ?:

            Then you get offended if someone is rude back ?

    5. Ed says:

      Sadly you’re right, Val.

  2. daren says:

    People have been saying Arteta out for months now regardless if Arsenal win or lose if he left today Arsenal would be screwed it’s just easier to blame the manager for everything people don’t like. No mention of the good he has done stupid people.

    1. Wyoming says:

      Arsenal fans are not special. Arsenal fans are no more fickle than any other fans. In fact all football fans are 99% the same world wide. When the team wins the fans say the Manager and the players are great. When the team loses the fans say the same Manager and the same players are useless. After Leicester useless after Man Utd heroes after Villa useless again so after we beat Leeds the Manager and the players will be heroes again. Every other fan base is the same

  3. gunnerforlife says:

    Its not a question, according to me, about Arteta in or out. It is too early at this stage to judge Arteta and one must give him atleast one full season to be fair. Arteta is doing a great job, no doubt, he has made us difficult to beat, he has made us competitive against the big teams, he has brought back belief in the team and also to a large extent united the players and fan base. However, there are some things which are a mystery to me:
    1. Not playing Ozil when there is no viable alternative, he would have definitely flourished with Partey and Gabriel behind him, he would have focussed on the attack and conjured up assists and goals. If not Ozil than Arsenal should have gone in for Aouar or Szoboszlai in the summer to make up for the lost creativity which is essential to break down teams. Sometimes offence is the best way of defence. If we score early it puts pressure on the opposition and that gives our team an opportunity to score another when the opposition make open spaces trying to equalise.
    2. What has happened to Saliba remains a mystery. He is neither loaned out nor playing for Arsenal.
    3. Arteta should go with a 433 system unless necessary and the players are being stifled and choked with the current system. There is no freedom to express themselves and he has got to change to 433 asap. Our team is giving more respect than is required to the opposition and the opposition is taking full advantage of that. This is not the real Arsenal. The real Arsenal goes at the opposition without fear. So Arteta must change formation and tactics asap because otherwise top 4 will soon be out of sight.
    4. Change in personnel-Arteta should not persist with Laca and Willian. Play Pepe as CF if required and bring in Nelson on the wings and Willock in the midfield.
    I trust Arteta and the process but time is short and in the League there is no much room for errors. All teams have improved and improvised and arsenal should do likewise if we are harbouring ambitions of top 4, which as Arsenal we have the right to.

  4. Lanre Falaiye says:

    Arteta is not the right person to lead Arsenal and regrettably even Kronke knows this. He has hired Arteta because he wanted a grateful hand who will not be able to press for demands. Arteta has exhibited his yes-man syndrome and it is obvious Arsenal is sinking deeper under him. If Kronke wants Arsenal back to the glory days he must hire one that is really in charge. If he wants Arsenal as a viable business venture he must pump in money to expect more money. Other clubs that spend money are not charity organizations. Another thing Arteta should bring back Ozil or hire a player who has Ozil’s quality. There is a vacum in Arsenal created by the absence of Ozil.

  5. ThirdManJW says:

    If 10 wins from 14 games, first trophy of the season, and away wins at Liverpool, Leicester, and Man Utd, without conceding, and beating the league champions twice, is a dreadful start to the season, I wonder what a good start to the season looks like?

    1. Mark says:

      Manipulating stats to suit your agenda..What about 4 loses out of 8 games and not having scored in open play for like forever..10 wins….Molde/…Dundalk….yeah sure…

      1. ThirdManJW says:

        First of all, I don’t have an agenda, secondly, I am just pointing out the ridiculous over the top reaction to our start to the season. Those who want Arteta out, less than 11 months into an extremely difficult job, are the ones with the agenda!

        1. ThirdManJW says:

          Yes Molde and Dundalk are easy games, but Liverpool x2, Leicester away, and Man Utd were all easy games to win as well? Ok then!

        2. Dennis Lawrence Moriarty says:

          @ThirdmanJW I don’t often post on here but what you have said is absolutely spot on. Many fans are far too demanding, unrealistic in my opinion. Those wanting MA out should be careful what they wish for. He will make a top class manager but needs time and patience. If we are not careful we might well drive him out and that would be a disaster for our club.

        3. jon fox says:

          TMJW,Well said! They don’t act like supporters and not recognising his immense achievements in such a short time – and considering the shambles he inherited – is wilful blindness!

  6. Highbury Hero says:

    I am one of those who believe we are title challengers this season. I have said so in your articles and reply to your comments but I have never said Mikel out.

    When you say same people who say we are title challengers winning champions League inside three years have changed their minds you should mention names.

    As a now regular reader of this site, I have seen a lot of those who say Arteta out are the ones who didn’t like Mikel from the start of this season and have been critical of him whenever an opportunity arise. Some were even called out for their silence on our Old Trashford display.

    1. jon fox says:

      HH you are fooling yourself by claiming we ever had a chance of the title this year. You are the sort of fan who DAN was meaning, when he referred to fan having unrealistic expectations. You cannot have it both ways,as DAN says!

      If you thought , as you admit, that we had a title chance or maybe you still do , then you must PROPERLY back this manager. If, in your mind , we were good enough to be title challengers before the Villa defeat, then we must still be so.

      I do NOT think we are anywhere remotely near that level yet for the simple reason that we have far too many poor to moderate players, whereas to be a title challenger we need a team of top players. I have always known that and fearlessly said so loud and clear. I am consistent in my views. It seems you are not so, even though you say you do not want him out. You HAVE, however, made many criticisms of him thus far, unfairly,IMO.
      I remain a massive supporter of MA, possibly his greatest supporter in this site, and see great qualities in him, though I also however see the huge problems he has to overcome, while under unfair pressure from many fans.

      1. Highbury Hero says:

        As I already said before I will concede the title only when it’s not possible to catch the league’s leader and that would be March at the earliest ( and that is if you realists get your wish) so I don’t see where having both ways come from. When I say I believe the team will win the league that’s automatic backing the manager 100% no need to even say it.

        I am not fooling myself it’s you realists who are fooling yourselves by waiting for the right time for the team to challenge for the title. Guess what? THERE IS NEVER A PERFECT TIME, PERFECT PLAYERS, PERFECT MANAGER OR PERFECT CONDITIONS TO WIN THE TITLE. The time is now, always!

        Our team is good enough to win the title. We have a better team than Aston Villa and we had better team than Leicester when they won the league so the argument of waiting until our team is good enough to challenge is senseless.

        Why does saying Arsenal will win the league make some people uncomfortable?

        ITS NOT ABOUT WINNING THE TITLE ITS ABOUT SUPPORTING THE TEAM! Do you want me to cheer for Man City or Liverpool because they are good enough? You have to cheer for your own and bash the rest with the best of your abilities.

        The problem with you realists is that it’s not about the team but about you. How can our team win the league if you realists always thinking of them as not good enough? Does the writer and other realists fans who goes to the Emirates bring with them this negative energy? If you go to the Emirates thinking the team is not good enough you transfer that negative energy to the players. And if you think they are not good enough why moan when we lose? It should be expected right?

        I have problem with this article where the writer says the fans who said we will win the league (we are two from what I have read) and those who said we can win champions League inside three years (I don’t think they are more than five) have changed their stance and now want Arteta out. That’s a blatant lie. I would like him to defend that paragraph.

        Those who want Arteta out (very few from what I have read) have always had dislike of him whatever the performance.

        The majority of the readers here ( I would guess 99%) have said we should give Mikel time and they don’t expect even top 4 this season let alone winning the league.

        So in my opinion the writer has taken opinions of few readers and generalized it just so he can say I told you so.

        1. jon fox says:

          HH, At least you recognise “we realists” which as you use it , means you accept “we realists” does not include you Give me realism before self fooling fantasy all day long.

          Ridiculous expectations and refusal to accept the truth(that we are not good enough for a title challenge) is like Donald Trump refusing to accept he lost. He lives in a fantasy world too. PERHAPS YOU ARE NEIGHBOURS !

          1. Highbury Hero says:

            That self fooling fantasy is mine and it doesn’t bother so I don’t see why it should bother anyone else.

            You mention Trump nearly in all your comments nowadays. It’s a suprise to me you are against him I could’ve sworn you are his number 1 fan because you have a lot in common based on the way you comment. 😉

            A real realist should not be a football fan whatsoever because as you wrote an article yourself it’s a one way affair (the complete opposite of my article if I manage to finish it in this lifetime).

            A football fan in my opinion should have a mixture of both dreams and reality. If we have realists every corner it sucks the fun out of the game.

          2. ken1945 says:

            HH, the new name for a realist might be VAR.
            I love your passion, belief and expectations and it must have been the way those Leicester fans thought at the start of their title winning campaign – probably had realists amongst them, who tried to tell everyone it was impossible – that’s the problem with being a realist in my opinion, the impossible is always achievable.

          3. Sue says:

            Nice one, HH 👍

          4. Highbury Hero says:

            Thanks Sue.

          5. Highbury Hero says:

            It would’ve been nice Ken if everyone give full support to the team for a change as we are not that bad as we are made out to be. Constant criticism, negativity and not believing in the team is not full support in my opinion.

            Our season so far has been a mixture of brilliant, average and awful performances. They are capable of good performance they have already shown that. It’s only a matter of time before they can do it consistently.

          6. ken1945 says:

            HH, you will find no disagreement from me my friend, as my life has always been full of excitement and expectancy – just like my support of The Arsenal – and I have had plenty of ups and downs.

            Never got me down though and I believe you have that same kind of outlook – following our club through thick and thin means you have to anyway!!!!

          7. jon fox says:

            HH seems that player support you mention – which I of course much agree- does NOT extend to our manager though, in your case! You constantly criticise him , unfairly and unwisely!

  7. Sue says:

    The honeymoon period doesn’t last long at all, does it?
    Here’s for a decent performance/result against Leeds, otherwise things will be unbearable!!

    1. Jax says:

      Who’d have though I’d be an admirer of Leeds of all teams, but with Bamford in the sort of form he’s in right now & the return of Philips plus Luke Ayling showing what we missed out on we’re in for a bit of another fan lambasting result unless…

      1. Sue says:

        I’m a massive fan of Ayling – please come back 😆 – he’s brilliant… also really like Phillips. They’re an exciting team to watch, and tbh not the team I wanted to face after such a horror show!!
        One thing’s for sure, Jax, there will be goals…. whether that’s from them or us, I’ll let you decide 😄

        1. Gunner23 says:

          I actually want a tough team like Leeds what better scenario to redeem yourself, Arteta should give the fans a little bit more exciting feeling when seeing the 11 vs Leeds but also the players need to perform. Every player says that Arsenal will get far with Mikel, well is time for the squad to give it best and have Arteta’s back. I hope that Arteta will bring the Arsenal game to Leeds and not the oppoosite.

          1. Sue says:

            Thinking about it, I don’t suppose it really matters who we face next, as all games are tough!
            They’ll want to get back to winning ways just as much as we do… their workrate worries me, especially thinking back to how lethargic we were against Villa!! Oh well, you never know, they may surprise us 😉 Would be very welcome right now!!!

    2. Kstix says:

      Hope the players respond well this time Sue, These overpaid premadonnas can’t stand toe to toe with that Leeds team, we think we were bullied by villa? Wait till we play Leeds, I’m lowering my expectations for that game like I did against utd, if we win, great. If we don’t, I won’t be disappointed like I was, expecting us to beat Villa at our home. And like the villa game, again on paper, we have better players but motivation-wise, Leeds have got a better team.

      I feel Arteta will make some mistakes like every human can but it’s way too early to start thinking he’s not the right manager. And I agree with your article Dan.

      1. Sue says:

        They’ve got to, we can’t sit through another no show, Kstix! Villa was an embarrassment!
        I was really looking forward to playing Leeds, as have really enjoyed watching them so far, but am really anxious now, as I’m unsure which Arsenal will turn up 😂😂 Our players have done well so far, for their countries, so hopefully a confidence booster, Kstix 🤞

        1. Kstix says:

          Fingers crossed Sue and we will have just 2 days to train together before the Leeds game. That is not a lot of time against a team that has 2 weeks to train, as hardly any of their players are away on international games. Pray we are also lucky on the injury front.

          1. Admin Pat says:

            Leeds have SIX players on international duty – We have 11
            “hardly any”???

          2. Kstix says:

            Thanks for the correction admin pat. 👍

          3. Sue says:

            Trust me, I’m praying 😂😉
            England U21s tonight….
            Looks like Nelson’s back, Kstix 👍

          4. Kstix says:

            Spot on Sue and here’s to hoping he’s integrated more into the senior team as he can’t be worse than those currently playing

  8. Shortboygooner says:

    I think we have to be honest with our selves. We have looked at the other big teams and seen how they have done things. Chelsea, Liverpool, City, spurs even utd. Most of them have had several different managers or payed top notch and gone straight for the best available. Our club dithered and got 2 cheap options and it has shown. The fans want instant success. Heck tbh I think we just want some sort of security and sense that we are in the mix as a respected team. When we sit back and look at things everyone and his dog has been saying the same things about our squad. 3/5 at the back is negative. Lacca is not good enough xaka and mustafi not good enough. Stop buying old players etc. I think this is where the arteta out has come from. This couples with the players not seeming to have a proper go at it. To be seeming to be just going through the motions.

    Overall there is a lot of things we look at and raise an eyebrow about and say hold on. Why didn’t you do this and if we are all honest we all think the same. It is too early for arteta out and I predicted by January if it continues like this ppl would be saying it. The excuse of inexperience is not good enough. You took the job now live up to it or you get found out and kicked out. Its not a primary school race where you get points for taking part it is the premier league where millions of ppl expect arsenal to be the best. And at the very least to be fighting.

    You lads that complain about fickle fans are the worst. We all want good football and want to express when we see crap. Ojt performance this season has been crap. Even against utd we would have only drawn without the penalty and if they win their game in hand guess what they are above us in the table. We will be the lowest ranks top 4 club. Oh I ment big six.

    Arteta get the squad selection right and get the tactics right please

    1. SueP says:

      Your frustration is absolutely justified, but there must come a point when a degree of stability is required, rather than calls for Arteta to be replaced so soon.

      I am not saying the guy is perfect, that he hasn’t got things wrong from time to time but we have to look at the point at which he took the job and the dire situation he inherited.

      Add to the mix the poor decisions at the top of the club and to a large extent, the quality of the players that had been brought in prior to his arrival. Then there have been extremely questionable transfer fees and generosity of contracts awarded but this was pre Arteta. There are several players that the majority wish were not still Arsenal players, but who wants them if they are on ludicrous contracts and won’t take a pay cut to move on and further their careers? Arteta can only do so much with what he presently has and it is clear to me that wholesale changes are not affordable stratightaway under the current regime, so whilst I really do understand your annoyance, what would a new manager be able to better with the same players, the same lack of money, and the same lack of real ambition from above?

      1. patH says:

        I do not think lack of money is the real issue. From 18 season to the present we have spent around 288 million. To my mind, you are right that the quality of the players that we have bought or loaned in have not been good enough and were overpriced and overpaid.. The real issue is not specifically the owner but areas of his management that has been or is not good enough. The owner has been at fault in his reluctance make the changes at the top of the club not from an lack of investment. He has of recent times pumped considerable sums into AFC and authorised the purchase of Partey. at a critical time when AFC where showing a big deficit on the balance sheet. I agree he could be more active but for him Arsenal Holdings is a business and that’s the short of it.

        1. SueP says:

          I take your point PatH and agree
          Perhaps what I should have said is where that money was put. It’s not to say that Pepe won’t come good but £72m was an awful lot of money

      2. jon fox says:

        SueP, ANOTHER REALIST AND THINK GOD, AS WE NEED EVERY ONE WE CAN GET ON THIS SITE THAT IS SO SHORT OF THEM!

        1. Phil says:

          Jon- could I ask you to please correct your spelling. It is very wrong if you to continually post replies without checking to ensure the Queens English is correct. Fank ewe

          1. jon fox says:

            Phil CARE TO POINT OUT WHICH TYPO YOU OBJECT TO PLEASE. I WILL TRY TO MAKE SURE MY TYPOS ARE KEPT TO A MINIMIUM, JUST TO PLEASE YOU!
            My spelling is superb and that is merely the comment of others who have told me so. A product of my having an English degree, I assume!

  9. Palash says:

    From fabregas,rosicky,hleb to elneny(although I like him),willock and willian.Our decline in the last ten year is really disappointing.Even some of the other club fans are now blabbering that arsenal are now not a big club anymore.We sold fabregas and nasri in the same window no big club does that what a shame

    1. Jax says:

      Arsenal are a big club (and always will be) but one that’s under performing right now. United are probably the biggest and also having a bad time recently. Liverpool another very big club went through this while small club forever Man City were flying high.

      1. Dan kit says:

        Bloody hell Jon ,I would calm that self praise down abit ,you won’t be able to leave the house soon ,trying to get that big head out the door and all that .
        Oh and
        Realist = know it all

  10. AndersS says:

    Doesn’t really help the writer totally unfounded calls Arteta “the cheap option” – does it?
    After all, Arsenal are one of the big spenders on transfers and on player salaries, so what indication is there, that we have taken Arteta, because he is cheap?
    Anyway, I do agree, he should be given time, unless it totally goes haywire, and there is no other option than the sack.

    1. Dan says:

      So you believe Emery and Arteta were our first choice ?

      1. AndersS says:

        That I don’t know and nor do you.
        But the point is, if you want fans to to take it easy, and give Arteta a chance, why do you then ridicule and undermine his status? And do you have any proof at all for such allegations? I doubt it.

        1. Dan says:

          Well not really
          Someone can be a cheap option but turn out great
          It’s my opinion so don’t need evidence

          1. AndersS says:

            And because it is your opinion and not supported by any facts, it is OK to call him “the cheap option”?
            It seems right there is an obvious place to start, if you really want to raise the standards.

          2. Dan says:

            Don’t understand what your asking ?
            Yes it’s okay to have an opinion
            I would argue most fans make conclusions without facts
            For example do you think David Luiz was brought because he was cheap or Because Arsenal thought he was the best defender in the world ?
            Going by your logic , anyone who thinks it might have been Luiz having a year left on his Chelsea contract would have to prove that with facts ?

  11. ken1945 says:

    Sorry to say it, but our fanbase is divided because of the fans – nothing to do with MA.

    We have fans on here, who just don’t debate the merits of other opinions, they actually try to make the fans who they disagree with look inferior or foolish.

    My ticket is in the family enclosure and I have never seen or heard any of the c**p that fans say to each other on here.

    I have followed our club for a long time and can never recall the split, hostility and downright intolerance of another’s opinion.. maybe the Internet has spawned this kind of behaviour, if so, the genie is out of the bottle for ever.

    How anyone can judge MA in just ten actual playing months and call for his resignation is symptomatic of the above and I despair at the lack of thought regarding the club’s state of neltdown when he arrived.

    We were in complete disarray, both on and off the pitch and that he has addressed.
    It’s the fans who are making the situation worse and a classic example was the article regarding Ozil and his performances for Germany – it had nothing whatsoever to do with the subject of the article, but was there simply to intice the JA split.
    Read the comments and you will see it has succeeded once again.

    I really have to stop and remember that this is a site for all Arsenal fans and that we are not different tribes at war with one another.

    For goodness sake give him some time and support the man – if I’ve reluctantly accepted some of his decisions, surely we all can – debate as mature and sensible fans not some ferrel cats in the back alley… and remember this, all opinions are that person’s belief and, if one wants to change it, treat that person with respect not ridicule.

    1. Fire says:

      Ken…

      Splendid! Splendid!! Splendid!!!

      With an exception of only a very few minds here, I often find it difficult to discover another with whom I could sustain a thoughtful conversation!

      And kudos to Dan, I always look out for his articles because they often ooze great thinking and perspective. And I trust that his articles will frequently attract the best minds here on JA.

      It is quite easy to observe that many comments posted here on JA often stem from typically inflamed minds, and it may be fruitless to engage such minds since reasoning, respect, and cordiality may be flung out of the window…

      I feel for Arteta because he for once maintained the same team that outperformed ManU, and then to his utmost surprise they gave a total opposite in performance levels. And so I can understand why many (even the best minds at analysis) cannot explain what happened. And for that reason, in my field of study, we would simply class such an element as an outlier. I pray it is an outlier in the long run, nevertheless, I remain confident and positive in the process at work, and I am convinced the results will follow sooner than later…

      For now, I simply hope the team remains professional, continue to study and learn from their mistakes, be confident in themselves and sustain their belief system. As Wenger would always say and I paraphrase, “respond to your critics by doing your talking on the pitch”.

      Always a pleasure Ken!

      Cheers!

      1. ken1945 says:

        My pleasure Flame and we do have some excellent fans on JA, all with passionate views that differ from other excellent fans with passionate views… the secret of a successful debate is the way it is conducted and how the participants treat each other in my opinion.

        Treat others with the respect that you want / expect to be treated yourself and this does happen at match days, as far as I have experienced.
        It’s a different world on sites such as JA, which is one of the very best in my opinion.

        This obsession with winning is where the clearest divide can be seen – of course we all want to see our club win and produce great football, but it takes time and patience.
        How some fans would have survived the Billy Wright, George Swindon eras I dread to think and I firmly believe MA will bring us success.

        1. Fire says:

          Ken…

          You are totally correct! And I agree with the requirements you mentioned to have a good and healthy debate.

          Surprisingly, both Arteta and Lampard are young managers, but even after edging Lampard to the FA Cup, and the early poor results from Chelsea, I am not sure many were/are calling for Lampard to be sacked. And by the way, they have turned the corner even when they are yet to play Liverpool, Mancity, Leicester, or Aston Villa. Also to be noted, they drew with ManU and Tottenham. So, I do agree with you that Arteta should be given time, moreso that he has played mostly the top teams at the moment, and only the loss to Aston Villa was below par…

          Luckily, the Internet was less pervasive during the Billy Wright and George Swindon era, so they can be thankful for that! *smiling*

          Cheers!

    2. Dan says:

      Great point Ken
      Never thought of that
      It’s true , at the Emirates I dont hear what you hear online

      1. ken1945 says:

        So, logically Dan, I must ask you why you think this is?
        I have my own views, but would like to know yours.

        Val’s point about the players being barracked is true, of course, but I have never witnessed personal abuse from one fan to another…even during AW’s last two years.

      2. jon fox says:

        DAN you probably know that I admire your wrIting style and think almost all of your articles are good value. I do take issue with your own phIlosophy when you ask for fans to support the team-with which I of course agree- but then constantly undermine and carp at our manager.

        By any sensible analysis of his first 11 moths he has done a superb job and none of your many and rather silly and unfounded crtiticisms of him are inany way fair. You seem to ignore the shambles he inherited from both UE and more pertinently from AW too. He has transformed the discipline, overturned our correctly held reputation for being easily bullied and bought some successful and top class buys in.
        He was won two trophies and instilled organistaion, defensive solidity and team discipline.

        HE HAS SET AND INSISTED ON CLEAR STANDARS OF GOOD BEHAVIOUR AND WORK ETHIC BEING OF VITAL IMPORT AND HAS SIDELINED THOSE WHO HAVE CHOSEN NOT TO BUY INTO THAT. He has shown outstanding ability and I for just one of several who have commented on this, reject your mealy mouthed criticisms of him, which are quite unworthy of a man of your intellect.

        You seriously need to stop this constant carping or you will be derided by me and others as foolish and immature. PLEASE TAKE THIS SERIOUSLY DAN.

        1. Dan says:

          Hey Jon
          I’m a little lost
          I back Arteta
          where do you feel I have undermined or carped the manager ?

  12. GunneRay says:

    Great article Dan. IF the club did indeed “appoint a man who would learn on the job”, then this club really is run a bunch of amateurs!

    It would make no sense what so ever for a club like Arsenal who were in such a bad position financially and in its poor brand of football to appoint a manager who is likely to fail. That is unless they had no money? But they did. They spent £72m on Pepe for a start. They sacked Emery at more cost (Time and money). Had options to buy experienced managers but didn’t and finally settled for Arteta. So why would any one point the finger at Arteta for continuous problems? This club is the laughing stock of modern football because the owners are so far from being “in the know” about English football, they could almost walk the moon!

    Don’t blame Arteta. The team have let him down. If he was to replace all the players who didn’t put a shift in against Aston Villa he would be selecting a whole new squad! One or two can have a bad game. But all eleven? Come on! Get off his back and give the guy a chance!

    The posts above from a lot of you above are correct about how toxic Arsenal fans are becoming. Shame on you!

  13. Grandad says:

    The increasing impact of social media has in itself created a new group of fans who get their kicks from lambasting players and Managers without any real knowledge or understanding of the game.Their ire is not helped by the aggression of certain Radio and TV pundits who seem to derive pleasure from criticising the selections and tactics of Managers and slamming players who fail to measure up to the highest standards.In many cases these pundits have themselves failed in Management and many were never more than average players who would never cope with the pace required today in the EPL.Fickle fans are found in virtually all Clubs, big and small , and will always be an annoyance to sensible , rational fans .Thankfully, they still form a small minority who cannot distinguish between good and bad behavior, and reflect a problem of our Society in as much as the game of football.I don’t have information to support by belief that age will mellow their views and outlook on Football and in life in general, then they in turn can become the voices of reason.Finally there is perhaps one word which aptly sums up most of the fickle or disloyal fans and that is ignorance.

    1. jon fox says:

      Hearty applause Grandad, on summing up so accurately the sad situation so many clubs have today with the social media age fans who just will not give anyone a proper chance. They expect eveything NOW. It is pathetic and so are they! You cannot expect to argue successfully with someone who just won’t think but will write first.

      They are a form of poison and its not just OUR club though we are among the very worst. It is largely an age based matter, as older people tend to have more patience with things we love.

      AND OF COURSE MORE LIFE EXPERIENCE, BUT THAT EXPRESSION IS LIKE A RED RAG TO A BULL WITH KNOW IT ALL KIDS!

      1. SueP says:

        I know we are old farts but in general I think ordinary expectations in life have changed so dramatically and almost from one year to the next.
        Mobile phones were like bricks and computers !!?? They were the size of your living room
        We just find it more difficult to accept the younger generation expecting to have everything right now, because back then we had to wait. What they don’t appreciate is that it’s just not possible to always have what you want now/immediately

        1. jon fox says:

          YES Sue P, Your post and esp your final sentence is so true. Sadly, the ones who most miss out by this “I demand it now ” attitude, are those young people themselves who cannot truly value something worthwhile as they constantly expect ALL in their lives to be worthwhile and life can never be like that
          .
          Older people who have been round the block several times know this very well.

  14. Shakir says:

    I beleive MA should be given more time.
    Its not that we dont have good players,lets just say we are going through a rough phase.

    Creativity is an issue but we do create enough chances to win us games though MA should figure out the scoring problems soon and i mean really really soon…

    This is not his philosophy,he has said that he wants to play a possession based attack so lets see,atleast give him this season.

    COYG
    TRUST MA

  15. lcw says:

    I have been criticizing MA for a while now not because I don’t like the person but because I don’t like his tactics on the field and the way he treats certain /.the players. However I always maintained that he needs time and most of all luck. In order for him to succeed with the press and defend tactics he needs to bring in his own players because the current ones won’t cut it. We all know how difficult it is to spend money with the current owners. Maybe MA will wise up and employ different tactics to take advantage of the talent at hand. Other teams are doing so already. Regardless to be fair, MA deserves more time and support period.

  16. Top Gunner says:

    He doesn’t have the attributes to be Arsenal Manager. We need guys like Vieira or Bergkamp

    1. SueP says:

      Top Gunner,
      Are you going on how both PV and DB played or on achievements in the managerial field?

      1. Top Gunner says:

        Those guys have Arsenal genes, even if we lose, we’ll enjoy interesting football. Losing by playing boring football is double impact

        1. SueP says:

          They certainly do🙂

          1. ken1945 says:

            Top Gunner, can I ask how you determine “Arsenal genes”?
            By the way, PVand DB are two of my favourite players, but have they had successful managerial careers?

          2. jon fox says:

            Ken why do you bother trying to debate with Top Gunner? I have given up with him! He is not a thinker or he would not be asking for great players with BUT with no real managerial pedigree to be in charge of us. Would he!

            I KNOW PV IS MANAGING BUT HE HAS NO PEDIGREE YET, WHEREAS MA WORKED UNDER PEP FOR OVER THREE SEASONS SPECTACULARLY WELL. No thought at all , only personal bias, went into his post and that is how he works!

          3. ken1945 says:

            I’m interested in how he thinks MA is not qualified but DB (especially) and PV are.

            Others, such as Tony Adams, Freddie, Thierry to name a few, have all got the Arsenal DNA in them, but have not been successful managers – while MA has won the FA Cup in his first season… just curious Jon as I might learn something.

          4. jon fox says:

            Ken Then you still believe that TOP GUNNER actually thinks! Not entirely in jest, I ask you where is your evidence for that belief in his “thinking”?

          5. Top Gunner says:

            That’s Arsenal trade mark. Quick passing and counter attacks. Graduates from Arsenal academy learn this kind of play. When introduced to senior team, they play different style. There’s no continuity. When I mention Bergkamp, I’m talking about classic display. Arsenal have plenty of good players, but their confusion comes with style of play

          6. ken1945 says:

            But wasn’t MA installed with the same kind of play?
            Also, why would you want to replace one “inexperienced manager (MA) with another (DB) inexperienced manager?”

            If you wanted to replace MA, surely it would have to be a renowned manager like, for instance, Allegri?

  17. Abul says:

    MA should be given some to prove himself. Agreed.

    His legs must however be held constantly towards fire. For Abraham Lincoln told us that ‘its the test of fire that makes fine steel’

    He the jobs comes with much pressure. If he can’t withstand the heat he should the kitchen. Period.

  18. Samuel Akinsola Adebosin says:

    I think it’s very inappropriate and disrespectful to call the Arsenal fan base i.e. us the Gooners a laughing stock. This is totally wrong and unacceptable.

    For, it is a complete disservice to what the Gooners stand for, which is supporting AFC to fight to win titles every season. And I think and believe that’s what the Gooners have honestly been doing comes rain, comes the burning sun, comes the winter freezing weather, comes the inconveniences associated with short and long travelling to the Ems and away grounds to watch the Gunners playing and comes spending their money to buy seasons and regular tickets to watch the Gunners playing and paying for TV cable subscription to watch Arsenal games. But despite all these sacrifices being made in support of Arsenal, yet, us Gooners are termed a laughing stock?

    This is unfair because us are not a laughing stock at all, but the passionate Arsenal fans who will not feel shy to say the true at any time as it’s affecting Arsenal no matter whose Ox is gore.

    Arsenal have lost four Premier League games out of the eight that they’ve played so far this season. And they have garnered twelve points out of the twenty-four that were on offer to them to collect.

    But Arsenal can still come back into contention to contend for the PL title win this season since there are still 90 points in the Arsenal PL campaign that are left which the Gunners can collec them all to possibly win the title for Arsenal on 102 points new record breaking Premier League title win this season if they collect them all.

    But can Arteta coached and managed Arsenal PL team win the title this season? Well, the current senior team performances in the PL by the Gunners this season is not indicating this will come to pass for Arsenal.

    If the club’s owner and his son including the Venkatesham’s Arsenal board want a senior team manager regime change at Arsenal this season, this is the right time for them to do the change during this current international break that is now five days into it.

    But it is not yet too late if Arsenal owner and his son want to effect a senior team manager regime change at the club. And employ Pochettino to immediately take charge of the Gunners and guide them to collect all the 90 points that are still available for the Gunners to collect them all for Arsenal. Which if they do collect them all, Arsenal could win the PL title this season. But if they are not outperformed by any of their remaining PL top five teams.

    1. SueP says:

      Samuel
      Do you think that Pochettino would come to Arsenal and if he did do you think he could win the league this season?

    2. Dan says:

      But clearly I’m aiming my views at fickle fans
      Can’t have it both ways
      If you ever verbally abused Mr Wenger, Mustafi , Xakha, etc
      You cant then cry if your called ‘ a,laughing stock ‘
      Why’s that not allowed but calling a player the C word okay ?
      Why’s it okay to mock bellerain for paying a tree but I call fans who act that way a ‘ laughing stock ‘

    3. Sid says:

      Lol, Poch and 90 points? Man I like your long paragraphs but come on, why Poch? Arteta is in his first managerial job and already has won one more trophy than that Spud fraud 😂😂

  19. Top Gunner says:

    Arteta should go

  20. Sid says:

    I agree with the central theme of the article. I have always maintained my stance in the ‘Arteta In’ camp and will continue to do so. I don’t portray him as better than Pep or Mr. Arsene, but maybe he can reach similar heights with Arsenal? Also although I don’t think we will win the PL this season, but mathematically it’s still possible, and I do believe we can win the CL in 3 years. That said, the failure to achieve those targets will not turn me against MA, so as Highbury Hero, I take issue with Mr. Dan’s generalization that the same fans who predicted a title charge or a CL win in 3 years are the ones changing their minds about MA. I think it is a mixture of fans with different beliefs.
    OT- I would like to congratulate the admins for making this the best Arsenal Fan Forum(IMO atleast). I like daily canon as well for their articles, but I really love the fan discussions here. Pain in the Arsenal is a site I go for the ratings and transfer stuff, but while their general articles are not bad, the fan comments are mostly negative, boring or highly analytical would be managerial pitches and that always prevents me from commenting there. Cheers to Just Arsenal family! And please keep up the good work!
    COYG!!

  21. Top Gunner says:

    With Arteta, we gonna sink further. There are different characters in any working environment. It’s all about how you manage those characters to be regarded as a good Manager. Arteta is bad news for Arsenal

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