A lifelong fans alternative view on the harm that constant negativity does to our club by Jon fox
Hello fellow Gooners,
I am keen to explain why I have no time at all for relentless negativity, as “promoted” by some fans on JA. Football and all of us are about PASSION. As our own passionate manager has been constantly emphasising to our team in those revealing Amazon Prime episodes, PASSION and excitement are vital tools in successful football. To passion and excitement, I would add BELIEF too, or if you prefer, “OPTIMISM”.
Without passion and belief, I see little point in any elite professional sport at all. That is my lifelong held PASSIONATE opinion and I stand for passion and belief, or else I stand for nothing at all.
Without a belief in our team, we would never bother supporting or attending or watching games. As evidence for the power of belief, look at what happens when a team has clearly lost a game, say by being three goals down with fifteen minutes to go, especially away from home. What happens is that fans who have lost belief stream out from ground and leave themselves and the team even more demoralised than before.
This is negativity in action, and it is an unprepossessing sight. Pessimists or “wet blankets” as we older fans call them, lose friends, lose hope, lose belief and IMO lose the right to call themself a supporter, even though they remain a fan.
A supporter is far more than just a fan; a fan may love the club, but a supporter actually supports, not only by attending but also by sticking by club they love, through thick and thin. A supporter is there when times are bad and yes, he/she may well moan and bitch, but they stay true and also look forward to better times, starting with the very next game, whether or not the team wins.
We Gooners are incredibly lucky to support such a great and historic club. Imagine if you supported say Hartlepool, Chester or Walsall, etc!! THEIR supporters know that they are never going to win honours. but they stay true. And why? Because they are REAL optimists and have belief, even though they know, deep down, that they are lowly clubs. But to those supporters their club means everything. THEY would be thrilled to come fifth and not moan about it and cry “woe is me” simply because their own often petulant demands for success were not met there and then.
You see, I have no time for the philosophy of doom and certain failure. And those many of us who have watched the exciting Prime episodes will have seen beyond doubt, that Arteta is the arch positive and passionate manager. The passion and belief he instils into our players has to be seen to be believed and IMO these Amazon Prime episodes, taken overall, show just what a top class and a demanding manager we now have running our club. There are no coasters, troublemakers and lazy players now and none will be tolerated either, as they all know, every man jack of them!
There would be no point in being a fan, if we had no belief, no passion. Indeed, without passion and hope that we can win things, why would anyone ever bother attending or watching matches at all. I say football without passion and positive belief is worthless. Bur being positive does NOT mean that instant success and trophies are bound to happen every season, nor even in most of them.
We are all entitled to our own views, and I emphasise that in a free society, all have the right to be negative if they wish – though they must realise that by so doing there will be many others who also have the same right to call out their relentless negativity.
Indeed, in one well known and regular writers’ case on JA, many HAVE called out that writer and challenged his constant and dismally negative articles and his replies to those posts that call him out, so now you have the opportunity to do the same to me.
In short, my fellow Gooners, like almost all fans at times we can moan and complain we would hardly hardly be human, if we did not. But in my firm view there is a whole world of difference between seeing both the good AND bad things we think are happening within our team and our club, while ON THE OTHER HAND, seeing nothing at all save NEGATIVITY AND GLOOM!
To me, those are the minds of troubled and relentlessly discontented and unhappy souls.
I would love to read YOUR thoughts on positivity versus negativity!
COYG
Jon Fox
CALLING ALL ARSENAL FANS! Anyone who would like to contribute an Article or Video opinion piece on JustArsenal, please contact us through this link…
Mikel Arteta pre match Bournemouth v Arsenal – Interesting in depth interview with the Boss…
Please enjoy, watch and subscribe to JustArsenalVids
Unfortunately, old controversies are the sources of highly debatable articles, to trigger a lot of reactions here
I’d personally prefer to keep moving forward and suggesting some solutions, instead of crying over spilt milk and splitting meaningless straws. Especially since the team is currently performing very well
Jon how did you refer to Xakha after we beat Palace ?
What you mean is it’s okay to be negative as long as you agree with it ?
Mentions lazy players ✔️
Mentions Dan Smith ✔️
Mentions the difference between a supporter and a fan ✔️
Try’s to tell fans how they should support our club ✔️
Surely the writer could have just said all this in his usual daily rants ,nothing new here just repeated words .
Pretty funny that a writer who talks about negativity and how a supporter should act seems to forget how he talks about an endless stream of our current players and how they shouldn’t be here ,STRANGE THAT .
Lastly I think the writer lost all credibility and his right to preach and tell fellow supporters how to support this club with how he treated an ex manager .
Completely agree. Happy to see how the writer is being schooled about his wrong views which has no substance and their main goal is to cause provocation and division among the fan base.
Am I mentioned lol
Didn’t read it
OPTMISM v NEGATIVITY AND GLOOM! Turns life into black and white. The gloomy vs the optimistic. Life is not like that. It has many shades of thoughts and feelings. You seem to have an ‘us vs them’, approach, which to me is sadly simplistic. Just does not make sense.
Well put
You have hit the nail on the head. Even though there has been division of opinions since Wenger’s days we have always understood we are part of the same family.
But this Crystal Palace supporter and Arsenal fan want to make it a civil war.
“But this Crystal Palace supporter and Arsenal fan want to make it a civil war.”
Nicely done HH!😂
“You see, I have no time for the philosophy of doom and certain failure”
Clearly not true.
“To me, those are the minds of troubled and relentlessly discontented and unhappy souls.”
So you feel content to continuously attack the people you see as being unhappy souls?
What good actually comes from “calling out” so-called negativity? At most, it just pushes people away… (People leaving the stadium early has very little to do with opinions expressed on a website.)
On another note, if you’re interested in protecting the sanctity of words, why are you so confidently defining fan and supporter as you did? Just for convenience, it seems. Many people see “fans” (fanatics) as the diehards, and I think they are more likely to stay to the end of a loss. Personally I think the two terms have essentially the same meaning (in the context of football).
Well put Davi 👍
I decided to find out the difference between a supporter and a fan…this is what I found
‘The fan idolises players, but often knows little about the club’s history. When a club does not do well, more and more seats will be empty, whereas the section of the supporters is as full as ever. A supporter loves the club, not the team and its players.
17 Oct 2013
what is the difference between a supporter and a fan?
http://www.times.co.sz › sports › 92356-what-i…
About featured snippets
People also ask
What is the role of supporter?
What is the difference between a fun and a supporter?
The supporter loves the club, not the players. The supporters will always rally behind the club, even when it loses its star players. To a soccer fanatic, identifying themselves with the club is a hobby, past time or source of casual entertainment. To the supporter, the club is a way of life.
25 Mar 2010
The difference between a supporter and a fan | Sunday Standard
http://www.sundaystandard.info › the-differenc…
I did the same. Looking up football fan also took me to a page on “ultras”. There’s not really an official definition for football fan or supporter that I could find – if you look hard enough you can find something to support whatever you want. Ultimately I think the terms are used interchangeably by most people.
(Could be wrong if course, but i haven’t seen anything official enough to be convincing either way.)
The words are being used here to divide a fan base from one person’s perspective,like you said fan and supporter can be used to what ever said person wants them to mean .
I see nothing different between the 2
A fan is a supporter and a supporter is a fan ,pretty simple really .
What the writer is trying to insinuate is that any person who supports Arteta is a supporter and any person that doesn’t is just merely a fan.
.
Agreed 👍
I think a fan is more appropriate in football. A supporter can support anything they want. For example the writer supports Crystal Palace attending their home games and all but in his heart he is Arsenal fan.
At the end of the day whatever any positive or negative person thinks about Arteta will count for nothing. It has no bearing on what he does. Eventually if the team keeps on doing well and finishes well more fans will be behind him. I saw him as having potential fro mthe start and even defended him when he finished 8th as against Emery. It doesn’t mean I have to accept everything he does. Everyone can have their say but should be guided so that tomorrow they make not look arrogant. Thsi is wh yI never fall for player hype or for anyone.I don’t expect but rather I inspect because people fail.
I like it!
After watching All or Nothing I now have total faith that Arteta will lead us to the Premiership title. At the beginning of last season after our 3 losses, I thought my Arsenal would be in a relegation battle by mid-November. By the end of last season Arteta proved me wrong and to be totally honest with myself, during this summer I had doubts he was the man to lead into winning ways again. Now, I’m not only convinced Arteta will win us the Premiership but also that the Kronkes love our club and have a tried and tested strategy to make us winners and that is building a rock hard, unfaltering togetherness where everyone has got each others backs. The support Josh gave Arteta during our low periods is testement to their sporting empire success. I love the togetherness we now have as a group between the players, manager and director. It is this togetherness that is vital in bringing success. It is this togetherness that has got the fans chanting again. I live 200 meters from the stadium and believe me, for the last 10 years I could barely hear our crowd. Since last season the singing has got louder and louder, in fact last weekend I could hear the singing 4 hours before kick off coming from the streets/pubs around me. The goal celebrations are super loud (and they give me a heads-up that we are going to score as my live feed is a bit delayed 😁). My point is the love I feel towards our club from our players, manager, director and fans is what will win us the Premier League this season. I am 100 percent convinced of this.
Well written AndyE and I agree with most of your comment but being pedantic I must point out we play in the Premier League, not the Premiership, which is in Scotland 😊.
Interesting article, thank you.
I really don’t think the problem is some here are “only” fans and others supporters.
I see it more as cognitive dissonans, which is quite human but makes some discussions or exchanges partly a waste of time.
A waste of time for me when they don’t agree with my views?
Pity you didn’t understand the comment.
Wow, a pretty adversarial view is what I would comment on! Mr. Fox, once again in his elegant, theater english gently dances around the site’s rules and refers to fans having an opposing viewpoint to him as discontent, unhappy souls. He then goes on to mention about Dan and his articles, symbolising himself as the beacon of positivity and Dan as the champion of negativity. I guess our fairminded, intelligent, realist Mr. Fox finds pleasure in the idea of dividing black and white in football and taking the generally accepted side always.
But I must say it is a pretty interesting article nontheless.
Then Sid, do you NOT think DAN IS NEGATIVE? Many others besides me say so and often. Have you ever seen any real positivety at all in his articles? And do you not think, as I do, that positivety is helpful and desirable, while negativity and pessimism is quite the opposite!
And given that you have written as you have (and IMO rather unfairly about me), what do you, despite this, find “pretty interesting”?
I agree I might have come across as disrespectful towards you, Mr. Fox. But, I found the article interesting because it presented an arguement which led me to think. Maybe I also agree? I just found that your general message of positivity towards our fans/supporters(wont enter into that classification as I dont know the difference, lol) to be a tad overpowered by your opposition to those having an opposite opinion than you(which currently is negative in general towards the manager). Now I also am very positive about the new season, and have seen the very people you mention also show cautious positivity in their thoughts after the games. Now you yourself know that people are different in their rates of acceptance. You have accepted MA and firmly believe in him quite early, while some like me have been on a constant see-saw due to the results. Some others who were initially impressed, have been put off by the 8th place finish and last season’s late collapse. It does take time for people to come around. I, like SueP, am of the opinion that we can have differences in opinion peacefully without having an adversarial stand in general. Also regarding Dan, lately I agree that he has been generally negative, but cast your mind back to Dan’s Articles on MA. He was initially very supportive of him. Similarly he has dished out positive articles when there have been positive instances happening. Now Dan has a certain image and standard for Arsenal which he sees currently as unfulfilled. If MA and Arsenal manage to turn around his perceptions I am sure the positive articles will flow. Also Dan isnt inherently negative towards Arsenal as any negative person would not organize the predictions league.
Hope I have answered your questions. Cheers and have a good day! (Maybe afternoon, apologies as theres a 5 hr time difference lol…)
Sid go see what he wrote about Xakha after palace game
His argument falls down
Sid, thanks for the full reply. You are clearly a modern thinking man and I wish you well.
Jon I wrote on JustArsenal for years now
The irony is ….you are the most negative fan on here lol
Constantly clashing with readers
Warned about your comments
Go back to the Wenger days and how negative you were then ?
I just find it a negative trait that even though we support the same team that there can be so many flare ups in our differing opinions
I would love Jon Fox to explain, why, in his own words, he constantly wrote negative things about AW from 2008 onwards?
That’s a decade of negativity, not just negativity, but personal attacks and a desire to see the man injured!!!
Secondly, why he continues to berate Xhaka and Elneny?
Players who have been awarded new contracts by the manager he says we should support 100%.
Again they are personal attacks that are a continuous tirade of negativity – yet he sees himself as the personified supporter we should all emulate.
This article is an attempt to show that anyone who doesn’t agree with Jon Fox’s views are not real supporters /fans…. this from someone who DOESN’T support the club with actions, but rather by rhetoric that will only divide the fan base.
It’s interesting to note how many have picked up his desire to watch Palace, but cannot be bothered to buy a ticket to watch The Arsenal, despite living just over an hour away from the club!!
I don’t need any lessons on how to support my club from someone who wished one of our ex managers actual harm as Jon did.
I don’t agree with everything Dan writes, but he always replies to questions asked and gives his reasons why – something I admire and try to emulate myself.
It will be interesting to see if Jon answers the many questions and thoughts that he asked JA people to give him.
It’s really surprising when those who are accusing others of being negative are not left behind themselves.
If you don’t go along with their views, you are considered toxic and negative.
Meanwhile majority of them have been negative for a period of time without anyone having to write an article about it.
In a nutshell, you are allow to be negative about everything that has happened with the past management and the team, but doing so with this current one is forbidden.
That’s when they dictate how a true fan should be. I wonder if they have been a true fan all these while untill this management came on board. If we go by their logic of true fan
OK Ken! I’ll answer but you need to first acceot that you and I COME FROM ALMOST OPPOSITE SUPPORTER PERSPECTIVES.
Many times I have written that to me, the team and club always comes first and above ANY single individual. That means above Wenger, above Ozil, above Xhaka, Elneny, Walcott and Uncle Tom Cobley and all!
Until and unless you ever accept that is my sincere andlifelong view and my opinion too( to which I am, as we all are, entitled) then you have not a hope in hell of accepting what I now proceed to ONCE AGAIN explain.
YOU WILL ONCE AGAIN ATTACK ME WHEN I NOW EXPLAIN, AS YOU ALWAYS HAVE DONE; THE REASON BEING THAT TO YOU THE INDIVIDUALS NEED COMES ABOVE THE CLUB.
That is why to this day you worship Wenger for his many years of glory, while I accept that he did great things for our club , until approx 2008, when his management style, for various reasons , only SOME of which were for relative lack of investment money, changed utterly.
He ceased buying powerful and tall players,in favour of smaller ones which he saw as being more technical.
If you recall Mourinho taking Chelse since about 2005 into the land of the physical monsters, Drogba, Terry, Lampard, Essien etc. I always knew that power and strength would beat an equal technique that was however of smaller and often too small stature
Millions of other Gooners who also put the club first and Wenger second, could also see this truth. But you were wilfully blind ofall this ,in your ongoing obsession with the by then fading talents of Wenger
My sincere belief is that after 2008 our club began regressing under AW and this became more and more pronounced , until the crowd turned on him and he had those needless and embarrassing demos against him continuing.
I agree this was not nice and should not have happened but he brought it on himself
Yes, we won three more FA cups but no serious title challenge since 2004 until he, lets say “resigned”. We came close in the year Gallas sat down at Birmingham, I believe 2008, but we blew up and unlike MA, AW never had the ability to be hard on players and unlike MA he accepted scivers like WALCOTT. Yes for a time MA also accepted Ozils antics but he eventually saw the light and despite Ozils transfer value falling to zero- partly because MA was FOOLISH TO AWARD THAT CONTRACT- one among several key misjudgement mistakes MA made while learning on the job and about which I HAVE ALWAYS AGREED AND ACKNOWLEDGED,despite lies being told about my opinions by SOME on here(not you).
The reason I have been loyal to MA – and I admitted having severe doubts around a year ago, is that I COULD ALWAYS SEE he was dynamic, intolerant of frauds like OZIL and would drive players far harder than AW ever did and that he would certainly transform out team, given a decent amount of time.
And IMO, he has TRANSFORMD THIS TEAM AND THIS CLUB AND I for just one among many, am extremely pleased that Kroenke and Son have extended his contract. We are seeing the fruits of that wise decision right now and I belive in loyalty to all which HEPLS OUR CLUB.
I also believe in fighting all that does NOT help our club. Until you accept that is how I Ken, then you and I will always fight. THAT IS REALITY Ken.
And now you have my explanation, BTW, for the umpteenth time too.
What an absolute load of old tripe you just posted jon ,complete and utter nonsense to squirm out of something you obviously cannot.
If all else fails go completely off subject and bring up Ozil Wenger and and the years 2008 .
Why don’t you just answer a question put to you .
Like why you wished harm on Wenger ?
And how that makes you the supporter you say you are and not just fan like the rest of us mere mortal’s .
You’ve written an article ,but have not responded to any of the opinions put to you ,I do not see one above that actual agrees with you ,something you was obviously hoping would happen .
You need to stop acting like some kind of chieftain and get back in your place which is with the rest of us simple fans .
Jon, you have failed, quite miserably, to answer any of my questions.
1. If, as you say, one has to support the manager / club, why from 2008, did you do the complete opposite whenever the opportunity presented itself?
2. Why, if you support the manager, do you, once again, take every opportunity to demean his decision on Xhaka and Elneny?
3. Why do you think that, by questioning some of his decisions, have you yourself have done in your reply, fans / supporters are not behind the club?
Points 1 – 2 and 3 would suggest that you are doing EXACTLY what you accuse others of doing!!
Finally Jon, I actually DO accept that we support the club we have both followed for more years than we would like to admit.
Your dig that I put a manager or player above that club is so preposterous, it’s laughable.
I mention players, when they have had a positive game, or when they are left out asking why that is.
I NEVER castigate any player as you do so regularly and, from the replies above, it doesn’t go unnoticed does it?
I have the PASSION and love for my club, that sees me make a round trip of about a 1,000 miles for every home game – there are away games that are nearer to where I live, but I SUPPORT the club by (I am a lucky Gooner) purchasing my s/t and spending money at The Emirates on food, drink and merchandise – you choose to go and watch Palace, then tell me how to support my club!!!
I’m watching Arsenal play wonderful football and I am ecstatic with what Mikel is doing – why on earth do you think I would feel otherwise?
Is it because I still respect Arsene Wenger, question the handling of Ozil, Aubemeyang and last year’s January window disaster?
What you need to understand Jon, is that what you claim is just your opinion and not THE blueprint on what makes a supporter of the club – if we all did as you do, the Emirates would be empty and Palace would have to build a new stadium.
KEN, Why do you totally ignore my straightforward comment that I FIGHT AGAINST ALL SINGLE INDIVIDUALS WHOM I SEE AS HURTING OUR TEAM?
THAT INCLUDES THE LATTER Wenger, Walcott, Xhaka Auba, Elmeny and all. WHY do you not see that comment? AND If YOU DID, THEN WHY IGNORE IT ONCE AGAIN AND KEEP ASKING THE SAME QUESTION WHICH I HAV ONCE AGAIN ANSWERED. You inability to see my CLEAR answer puzzles me!
KEN I have just posted a fulsome reply but it has disappeared.
b
😂😂😂😂😂😂
As somebody who really like the manager’s personality, I must say that I wasn’t disappointed by our failure to qualify for the champions league last season but the fact that we lost it from a position of strength. I might not agree with many of their views but I see “those with agendas against the manager” as the wake up call that we need most of the time. We should stop looking through rose tinted glass and rather accept the fact that he failed last season. Let us accept the fact that he still has a lot to prove. “Those with agendas” has given arteta his dues time and time again and are true supporters. Now don’t see me as one mature mind as I am only 18 but I do believe that it is the true state of the club. COYG🔴🔴🔴🔴🔴🔴