Everyone needs a point…. by Matty Barnes
Now, as contentious as this might be (and the responses to this article will highlight my point) is that there’s something utterly pointless about replying to an article on this site, (which incidentally often features some brilliant insight on Arsenal), if your sole purpose is just to argue for the sake of it…and guess what, I’ve been reading loads of past articles on JustArsenal and it appears there’s a few on here that just do that, for what reason I have no idea…
I was inspired to write this having just read the text and replies to an article where someone suggested perhaps winning is more important than watching pretty football. Someone replied with an endorsement saying that while some of the football under Wenger was good to watch it was also frustrating to also lose to Stoke to which someone then responded and told him to stop having a pop at Wenger!!
It was clearly a point of fact in the main text and it demonstrated an example of what the author meant and it had nothing to do with AW directly.
It then generated a pointless discussion, completely off piste, of which we’ve seen on JustArsenal countless times: Proper playground politics..
I was once told a valuable life lesson which was ‘don’t just argue for the sake of it because when a time comes when you believe passionately about something people won’t know that because you “ argue over everything and anything’…. that stuck with me and I totally understand that.
So next time maybe spare a thought for the person that’s written the JustArsenal article and constructed it with a bit of thought for your benefit to read and if you have a genuine point fill your boots but if you’re just arguing with him or her because you’ve not nothing better to do with your time, have a word with yourself….or better still write an article in full and send it to JustArsenal to show you have an opinion on something rather than just an argumentative streak…and remember, it’s not just our clubs that needs a point or two, it’s the Arsenal fans as well…
People come to this site to have human interaction, be it funny remarks, positive comments, hostile replies or arguments
Online interaction is a part of football entertainment. It’s going to be boring if we just watch the games without making remarks and arguments with fellow fans
If you don’t like someone here, just don’t reply to his or her comments. Those comments will stop if nobody replies to him or her
I scarcely comment here ,but I do read a lot of articles..
Football forums are characterized by both constructive ,critical and careless comments…
For fans football to a large extent is just fun…who wants to argue or not ,for me it’s still fun…
Fan opinions and thoughts ought to be expressed and this is a good forum to do that. Nobody holds anything personal against anybody and hardly anyone knows anyone. What fans write cannot be always be called as arguments and it could be also said to be constructive criticism. As long as each and every one of Arsenal fans who write on this forum have the interests of AFC in their heart, they should be allowed to express freely without hurting the sentiments of fellow fans. What is the use of watching a full match if one cannot discuss/write/comment about it with fellow fans? It would be routine and monotonous. Whatever we say and comment on this forum should be for the overall improvement of AFC in general and logical analysis of certain factual points in the game in particular. We all love our dear Arsenal and that is why we are expressing our feelings, thoughts and ideas. We are a team not used to parking the bus but rather play expressive and expansive football. So that DNA thought process is translated down to all Arsenal fans and that is why we find so many fans commenting/writing about articles on this forum.
An argument to me is just a discussion. A quarrel on the other hand sounds like what you’re talking about. A bit of tit for tat, a dispute, and so on. Argumentative is just healthy debate to me, either you will make what you believe is a more than fair point, or another guy/las will come out with a fairer one.
B-o-t Spot on! Why are some folk so afraid of contrary opinions from their own! Argue and discuuss your own and others point of view and COMMUNICATE! What is the alternative anyway: “Oh I agree” “So do I” “And me” “And me too” Yawn!
Most of the time, I just make a comment and leave it. I don’t even go back to read replies
Once in a while I’ll read replies
and reply back but trying to stop that
I just want to give my opinion and leave it at that. Arguing is a waste of time because everyone has opinions and stick to their views
Test: your mum has smelly armpits.
Good point Matty. It also seems very hard for some to put forth counter-arguments without judging an other’s opinion.
People also seem to get invested in their past opinions. If they once expressed an appreciation of a player they seem unable to acknowledge a bad game or decline of the player. Or wise-versa. They like Ozil and are unwilling to acknowledge when he had a lesser game.
I think Ancelotti is the absolute wrong manager for us. But if he becomes our manager and sees signs of imporvement I will gladly acknowledge them. I am not too invested in my opinions and am always looking to adjust them based on what I see. Football is a game, an art, opinions about that are subjective. Why get invested in them?
I post under the name Truth tongue in cheek because in football there is very little truth despite us trying to sell our opinions as truth.
Most fans (like myself and a friend that first showed me this site) love to come here because of the interactive way the site is set up. The premise is to create a medium where opinions can be stated and counterintuitive debates can be held between fans of Arsenal football club. Naturally, not every fan is expected to have the same outlook on the same situation but it does get to the point where fans on her take it to a toxic level. I’ve been coming on here for 7 years now and while I initially didn’t comment on articles for a few years I’ve always loved reading articles from different writers and reading comments, lots of which have improved my knowledge about Arsenal and football in general. I don’t have lots of interactions which involves multitudes of fans sharing opinions about my club and relating to it. Places like this give people especially ones that don’t live in England the forum to. When I first started coming here I remembered it to be a conducive atmosphere which slowly changed to toxic verbal exchanges sometimes. The cause of the change I won’t say I know why but a big evidence is the divide that grew steadily toward the end of Wenger’s reign and the perceived lack of trust between fans and the club hierarchy. The roller coaster ride of emotions started repeating itself every season and people started expressing their thoughts in the most passive aggressive ways they could, myself included sometimes. As humans we can’t help the innate pride of having the right to say anything we want to, but as humans we have to consider the effects of our words on other people’s pride and opinions.
So to answer your question, yeah most fans come here for the action and arguments are ways of comparing opinions and pointing out facts but not when it gets to the point where you come on just to find fault in other people’s comments or prove someone else wrong. Everyone is entitled to an opinion and you can’t force yours on someone else.
Is this likely to change? Absolutely unlikely
I guess we just have to accept the monster we’ve become.
OG – that is a very interesting point – I had never thought of the dialogue here matching the enviroment but it makes sense and likely shows up on the pages. A lot of the heated debate stems from how one views Wenger in general and over the last few years. There are some very black and white opinions on this subject (a god vs a loser) and they come out quickly, especially with certain posters.
My sense is that the majority (vast majority) argue quite nicely and I do appreciate a different point of view.
And to mirror another of your points, being in Canada, I like getting the insight from Great Britain and other parts of the globe.
If you want to see nasty, check out National Hockey League forums!
A debate is to say i am right and you are wrong….and we can go on to even kil each other ….to reason is to ascertain the truth … to learn ….
When there is a cause for argument on an issue concerning Arsenal, the club’s fans could argue over it to make their thoughts on the issue known. e.g. when Arsenal are having a difficult season to not win in 9 games in all competitions was an issue that led to a debate being debated on the issue among the Arsenal supporters who were making attempts to come up with solutions in a form of advice to solve the ongoing problem by preferring their own kinds of solutions to the problem in their thinkings it will solve the unwinning run problem. And arguments and counter arguments could develop between fans with opposing views pneumonia how to go about putting an end to the problem which sometimes lead to quarreling and abusive language seen used on the JustArsenalnews site by some Arsenal supporters.
The self confirming irony of this article is hilarious… Do people come here to argue? ‘I don’t know, why dont I ask a contentious question that facilitates a jolly good argument’ hehe
Matty Barnes, a fan site without an argument is like a club without a ground. useless! Why are you so against arguments anyway; they are only exchanges of views and nothing wrong with that. Not in MY book anyway. If you are not allowed to say what you mean, then why have a site at all?
OK, so some articles elicit more comments than others, and then comments lead to counter comments and counter-counter comments. Call it arguments if you will. Disagreements, too. I mean, personally I thought the article on whether beautiful football is more important than winning trophies was a complete waste of space. But hey, that’s MY opinion. Now should I keep quiet just because I don’t like the article, and only comment when I do?
The fact that poeple are different and think differently makes the world go around. How boring would life be if we we were all the same. No Boris Johnsons and Jeremy Corbins, only clones. Where’s the fun in that?
However, having decided to diffet, let’s remain civil, let’s not get personal in the comments and call each other fools and idiots (even if we sometimes think exactly that 😀😀).
I love reading a good old arguement on here, a nice bit of Just Arsenal Handbags is entertaining so thank you the usual suspects………..you know who you are ! hahaha
In terms of boards and such today, this is pretty tame, and I am glad for it. Disagreement is fine but there isn’t a great deal of name calling (not zero, but not terrible by any stretch). There are a couple of people that seem to go at each other but for the most part this is a pretty safe place.
Lads and lasses, I wrote this with a tongue firmly in my cheek BUT at this special time of year, and also many of us live in a very divided country, we are ALL Arsenal, we all celebrate and suffer at the same time, perhaps to different levels but essentially we all feel the good and bad. I think different opinions are crucial and help educate us all. That’s the strength of this group. Merry Xmas to you all (if you’re Jewish or Muslim please don’t take this as an invitation to have a pop at me for not acknowledging you don’t celebrate this Christian festival x)
Well said, Matty! Happy Christmas to you too 🙂