Is it time to take a risk on the youth?
Mikel Arteta’s Arsenal side has hit a rough patch for what feels like the first time in a long time, but is bringing back memories to the end of last season and the downfall that followed. There’s a lot of Arsenal fans out there criticizing the manager and a number of players, but I think it’s important to remember we are still well and truly in the race. Although we’ve recently had some setbacks, it’s how you bounce back and recover from those that really matter.
Coming into the second half of the season, Arsenal will need to be at their best and the next few games might open up the chance for some fringe players and younger lads to get a run. Our next 5 fixtures are Palace at home, Forest away, Liverpool at home, West Ham away and Burnley away and for me, other than maybe the Liverpool game, I think this could be the perfect time to give a few lads a chance.
Our attack isn’t linking up like it was last season and you can blame individuals all you want, and when it comes down to it and you look at the bigger picture, they’re just not clicking at the moment. It seems like all the progress we made in defence, has now been somewhat stumped by our lack of goals and connection up front.
Last time Arteta was in this position he looked to the academy and gave a few of the younger lads a shot, who have since come through and made a huge impact for Arteta and the club, proving that if you’re good enough, you are old enough. Maybe it’s the right time to give some of these younger talented academy lads a shot in the first team squad and it feels like the perfect time to do so.
Ethan Nwaneri is a player I’m sure a lot of you have heard of, he’s only 16 but had been putting in some stellar performances with the U21s that has since earned him a regular call up to the first team on the bench. The young midfielder has only made a first team appearances once against Brentford and recently signed a new contract with the club after his debut. He hasn’t since had the chance to prove what he can do but after watching the U21s, he’s been extremely impressive.
Another young talent that I’m sure you’ve heard about Chido Obi-Martin is 16-year-old centre forward who’s been setting the academy alight after going viral in an U16s game against Liverpool for scoring 10 goals in one game. He’s a player I think needs a lot more time but could possibly impress if given the chance. He clearly knows how to score a goal and could be worth the risk for 20 minutes.
There’s plenty more youth to chose from and have a look at, Lewis Skelly, Ruell Walters and Sagoe Jr are another two prospects that will hopefully be given some first team football this season.
What’s your thoughts Gooners?
Daisy Mae
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Clearly zero research went into this article because Arsenal had the youngest squad in the league last season, and third youngest this season.
I would argue that more youngsters is the very last thing we need right now. What we need right now is more experience to help us get out of this rough patch.
The article is pandering to those who have been criticising and complaining about the limited use of academy players.
Clearly zero thought went into this comment because that’s not what the article is alluding to.
No, I’m correct on the zero research. Because if you know your footballing history, you’ll know it’s very rare that academy players make it at top clubs, especially in recent decades.
Further more, if one academy player does make it at a top club, it’s even rarer that another will at the same time.
Arteta has more than proven that he’s willing to play young players, a lot by the way, so it cannot be a criticism of him that he’s not picking any academy players, especially given the timing.
As I’ve already said, we don’t need more inexperienced youngsters at the moment. Unless it’s Messi level standards, a 17yo with no experience isn’t going to do us or the player any favours during this difficult period.
So yet again I’ve very easily crushed your point PS-JA with hard facts, and I know you loathe facts! You can apologise now, and be on your way.
Jen’s main point is relevant. Several of our key players are still young and probably yet to reach their ceiling. Many of the playing being cited are quite young for the PL.
It is very difficult to win a championship even with seasoned professionals and there is a fair amount of historical antecedent to suggest that more experience should be considered.
The point of the article is that there are some players in our first team that either aren’t good enough and/or are declining. These players should be benched while the academy players get a run out.
I’m not sure how anyone can disagree with extremely talented youngsters getting a chance in the place of players that are on poor form or need a rest, especially in games that we are comfortably winning or “freebie” games.
I agree we don’t have the money to spend because off FFP rules so bringing in youngsters is a logical step for Arteta. This also gives these players belief.
Agreed. PJ-SA, David, and Jen’s second paragraph all set out very good points. The only mention in the article of MA’s actions is praising him for looking to the academy and benefiting the club by doing so.
This sensitivity and arrogance with regard to anything that might be considered something MA just might, just might do differently as being some kind of assault on how well he’s doing as our manager is ridiculous imo.
This is an ad hominem attack which is uncalled for. I have addressed the points as I see fit.
Instead of addressing the points you resort to insults. I would suggest that you withdraw this comment.
I have read many of your posts and you are capable of putting well thought posts.
I am saying emotional posts because it’s true. I have never seen you or Jen once agrees with criticism against Arteta however factual it is.
Some of you even defended him when he criticized himself! If that is not emotional I don’t what is!
In my post I have indicated my own views on this issue but you have chosen to attack my person rather than address the points I have made.
We can debate different viewpoints regarding the team and the manager but your personal comments are inappropriate.
@Jen, I agree with you about the fact that we have a young squad. However, academy players bring this aura of hunger and dedication (together with a raw talent that can be moulded)to their play in most cases. Arteta won’t be the first top team coach to introduce academy players to the first team if he does.
Just look at what those academy players did to us against Liverpool, ManCity is another team where academy players having a good run-in.
I believe we can’t underestimate what academy players (two, three or four of them) can bring to the team when it come to improving performance of the team in certain situations.
Lino Sousa is the youngster who needs to be played asap.A natural left back who has a great future ahead of him.Zinchenko and Kwior are clearly uncomfortable at LB and while Sousa is only nineteen, if he is good enough, he is old enough.Will our “protective” Manager bite the bullet and play him?
👍Grandad
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No not the time for these youngsters to be thrown in at the deep end.
What Arsenal needs now are some powerful and experience players which has a presence.
The youngsters should be playing in the league cup and any other opportunity where there’s less riding on the results!
The problem is MA has such horrific form in the cups that they never get a chance.
We recently had a UCL game that was a complete free hit and we all saw how MA treated the perfect opportunity to give the youngsters a run, also the opportunity to rest most first team players.
Evidence is there for all to see, those that are objective anyway! MA doesn’t care about our youth players, his only concern is how much money he can get to buy more players. Cheque book manager, that’s the reality I’m afraid.
Hate to admit it but you are spot on. MA is no George Graham who brings in youth. MA is too arrogant and stubborn. It will cost him his job one day.
I was incensed after the PSV game that MA did not even give the youngsters a substitute appearance and even more disgusted at how some MAKBs tried to justify that with loads of BS. It was an inconsequential game FFS. If that’s not a good enough opportunity, nothing is. Thinking about it still makes my blood boil
Arteta had a fantastic chance to play the kids in the dead rubber v PSV and instead opted not to start or even bring them on.
Same on Saturday when Liverpool chose to bring on 2 youngsters he waited until too late to make a change.
“Evidence is there for all to see, those that are objective anyway! MA doesn’t care about our youth players”.
Complete lie! Youngest squad in the league last season, third youngest this season.
Serious question: so despite all the young players used, you think MA needs to play even MORE youngsters to help us step up to the next level of winning the league?
@PJ-SA
Younger first team players are completely different from our academy youngsters, it’s really not difficult to understand. The fact that you can’t determine the difference is not my problem 🙂
I know what the difference is, but clearly it is you that cannot see my point.
The point being, we’re already using a ton of youngsters, so it would be high risk process throwing in even MORE youngsters, especially at a time when we’re struggling to get results.
I knew you wouldn’t answer me, because you know I am right, but I’ll ask one more time and lets see if you have some humility about you.
So despite all the young players used, you think MA needs to play even MORE youngsters to help us step up to the next level of winning the league?
I think it might be asking too much of very very young players that haven’t hit full physical or mental maturity to step in and contribute for a team in the top 4 of the EPL. If we had some Carabao cup games maybe, but even then it would be a huge ask. They would literally be on the pitch competing with guys almost old enough to be their fathers. A player who isnt ready for that can be destroyed and ruined before they ever get a chance to shine. I know the old saying “if they’re good enough, they’re old enough”, but honestly, who is the last 16 year old that was getting regular minutes at a top 4 side?
I do believe that was a certain Wayne Rooney!!
Exactly my point. One of the greatest footballers of the last 25 years. All these young players in our stable could have excellent careers and still be nowhere close to the likes of Rooney. In all but the smallest percentage of cases, 16 or 17 is just too young.
ken, look at the influence of George Graham, who (as one example of many) in 1986/87 made an 18 yo CB Tony Adams, a regular in his team which won the League Cup that season for the Arsenal.
Cesc Fabregas
Perhaps bring the youngsters into the first team so Arteta and his coaching staff could develop them under his system and style of play.
For example, Patino is better than Vieira (IMO), and would not be a problem replacing Elneny on the roster, who never plays.
Patino can learn from Rice, while assistant coaches sharpen and polish the tools Patino has. Is it not wise to seize an opportunity like this, especially when he is not relying on a player like Elneny or his roster spot?
Or Walters or Souza replace Cedric Soares on the roster, so they also can be developed without Arteta having to rely on them when White, Tomiyasu, Kiowor, Zinchenko, and Timber are the preferred choices?
I think it would be a good debate to have, where the team benefits, after all, isn’t Arsenal what is most important? Before players and managers?
@Durand, i guess you’re yet to check the latest training gallery in Dubai released by the club. if you can take your time to check, you’ll find out that Mikel took along academy players like Ethan,Lino,Reuell and Myles cos they are ACTIVE at work in Dubai. hope that indicates to you and others that the youngsters are being “developed under Mikel’s system and style of play”. And note this is not the first time.
Vamos
I mean a serious commitment, not a short trip to Dubai, or a call up for PSV and then back down to U-23 squad.
Perhaps you didn’t quite understand my point?
Elneny and Cedric have contributed nothing, and their roster spots could be occupied by Patino and Walters instead.
EVERY DAY training with the first team, assistant coaches working closely with them regarding Arteta’s style of play, and sharpening their tools to match the squads needs.
We saw this with Wenger, and how he got value from our academy.
Arteta relies too heavily on the checkbook, and has not made good use of the resources available to him.
Our bench players have not been as productive as we hoped, but they need game time to stay sharp and ready, and rotation and game management continue to be a problem for Arteta.
Players and situations could have been handled better, and because they were not our options are limited and restricted.
I was put in moderation for a long time until last two weeks. I am far from allowed.
@Jen.
NO ONE is allowed to attack or abuse any other reader. You are the one right now that seems to relish putting other Arsenal fans down.
Discuss football without insulting other readers or you will go back into moderation…
Wtf! Clearly you haven’t bothered seeing the abuse I’ve taken!
“NO ONE is allowed to attack or abuse any other reader.” So please explain why I’m allowed to be abused then? Why is it, one rule for one, and one rule for the other?
Go and read PS-JA and HH comments, the vast majority of the time them attacking me, and not the other way round.
You will find ALL abusive posts are deleted. There is a difference between “attacking” and disagreeing with someone. Put your opinion clearly but do not attack anyone who disagrees with you.
So it is different rules for different people then. I got it. Take the abuse and outright lies, and don’t defend myself. I gotcha!
Aren’t you the one who lied I am abusing you in your other socials when I don’t know anything about you just like you know nothing about me?
I don’t even use any social media other than WhatsApp.
That was nasty!
And you have the audacity to call others liars?
It’s not the players who have played already played, the article is asking if there are more youngsters who MA could justify bringing into a squad that has just been humiliated in the 3rd round of the fa cup (once again) and lost the last two PL fixtures to London rivals and are slipping down the league because of that.
Now WHY would anyone think that would be a good idea?
We haven’t won a major trophy with the youngest (I thought it was the 2nd youngest) squad of players and, IN FACT, bottled it completely last season by throwing away an eight point lead, with just a handful of games left.
Why have we spent nearly £800,000,000 on new and experienced players, re-signed other esoerirnced players and yet, we find ourselves out of both domestic cups and sliding down the PL table?
Isn’t it about time these experienced players and their manger actually earnt their salaries?
None of our academy players deserve to be dropped into the s@@t just because the above aren’t doing their jobs.
I am with Ken 1945, Gunsmoke, Jen and David.
Now is not the time to introduce the youngsters unless we are 2 or 3 goals up with 5 to 10 minutes left to play.
I do take slight issue with PJ-SA regarding the CL match. I thought that a win was essential for getting top spot which was vital. I am sure you can correct me if I am wrong, although I have nothing against blooding a youngster under the right circumstances
SueP
I apologize for jumping into your comment, but I believe the last CL group match was a “free hit.”
Meaning we already topped the group, and a 0-3 loss or a 4-0 win would not change our standing in our group.
IMO a perfect opportunity to field players who are “rusty,” give youth players a chance, or even experiment with players in different positions or different tactics.
A regretful missed opportunity, because “free hits” like that do not come around too often.
You are correct Durand and that game would have been the perfect time and have made sense to introduce new and younger players – that was why we all believed MA took some of them out there wasn’t it?
The fact that he didn’t play them was explained by him and, agree or not, that’s why he’s being paid a reported £8,000,000 a year – sink or swim decisions!!
I do have this nagging feeling that he doesn’t trust players he hasn’t been actually involved with, regarding signing them.
Remember Martinelli?
He only got his chance once Willian was injured and we ALL know that ESR is being overlooked and NO he isn’t injured!!
But come on, imagine playing any of them against Palace and we get hammered – think what that would do to their confidence…and ours of course.
For the most part I agree Ken, but there are exceptions, although rare I admit. It really is up to the club and manager to decide if they are ready. And Arteta was wrong to loan Saliba again, for example, something Arteta himself admitted.
Saka was playing for us at 17 and was impactful and not overwhelmed.
Martinelli, in a new and vastly bigger league, and new country and language as well, was extraordinary under Emery at 18; 10 goals and 5 assists.
Fabregas at 16 played well for his age when introduced.
I’m not saying our current crop falls into that category, but perhaps a cameo appearance to see how they handle the opportunity? Patino for example, is he really so far behind Vieira? Is Walters or Souza?
I guess it is just that not a single one has come through under Arteta so far, or at least even received more than an appearance and then back out again.
I agree wholeheartedly with your final paragraph Durand and remember so well when we argued that Martinelli should be given the opportunity long before it happened.
Likewise, the situation we now find ESR in mirrors Martinelli’s situation, playing Odegaard no matter what his form is.
I really don’t understand why MA is getting all this praise for Saka, Martinelli and Saliba, when he inherited all three.
But you also have to register your full champions league roster before the tournament begins. After it’s submitted, those are the only guys you can have unless you remove an existing player from the group. So its not like we could have just taken a bunch of kids and played them even.if the game was meaningless. You always want to register your best 25 for the event and carrying too many 16 or 17 year olds just in case compromises your full squad
Players who are under 21 and have been at the club for at least 2 years do not need to be registered in the A-list of 25 players. Therefore the majority of the academy players do not need to be registered, but can instead be included in the B list.
One side note regarding the “free hit” PSV match. The better PL clubs do in Europe, the more likely that the champions league places will go to the top 5 rather than top 4. It is possible that in calculating whether the PL gets 5 rather than 4 UCL places for next season, a win in that “free hit” match could end up making the difference.
Thus, if we finished 5th in the PL this season, if might be that we only get into the UCL if we had beaten PSV in that “free hit” match.
Interesting point BB
I feel that somewhere along the line, it was essential to win. I’ve been reminded that I was mistaken
SueP, two examples of why MA might have not seen it as a “dead rubber” are given in this article (Gunsmoke and BB) so everything is not as clear as it seems sometimes!!
So often we don’t know the whole story, don’t have all the “facts”, or have been provided incorrect info in some way. Everyone interprets things in their own way. What is really annoying to me personally is when certain commenters believe that they have the only answer to any question.
Their first line isn’t to start providing their opinion or take on a matter but often to start running down another commenter or article writer. It’s great to be firm in your opinion or believe you have all the facts, but it is another to insult others without being open to the slightest possibility that you may be partially or completely wrong.
It’s a shame more gooners aren’t like you and Sue P. Thanks.
👍Durand, opportunity lost.
I’m really going off Arteta again. We are really in position to win the league this season. We are in the mix. Nketiah is not good enough and he has two suitors….30 million. We could top up and get this Joshua Zirkzee for 50 and stay within FFP ..but Arteta is definitely too scared. To me Arteta cannot win the league. He bottles it when the going gets tough and it reaches the players. The fact that he bought a player like Havertz is a warning sign. He will not win the league unless he signs a real goalscorer…. instead we have Havertz. Sorry but I am being honest…and others think the same.
Yes we should give youngsters a chance, bring them on for 20 mins in games we are going to win…that will give them confidence.
Sean, your last paragraph cites a different scenario to the article and one I would fully endorse.
But WHEN have we actually been in that situation in the PL, apart from the Sheffield United game?
Ken
If we get a real goalscorer….personally I like Dusan Vlahovic….we may get far enough in front to bring youngsters on. With our system, Martinelli and Saka are now doubled up on, so we can virtually never get far enough in front to bring the kids on.
Agreed, we see this doubling (even tripling up in some cases) at every game, yet fans bemoan the two of them for losing form!!
If they were losing form, why double up on them?
Surely Sean, if Saka and Martinelli are being “doubled up on”, this occupies the attention of two defenders, which should allow midfielders like Odegaard and Havertz and the CF Jesus/Nketiah more room to drive forward into the goal square. Why has this not been happening under Arteta’s “system”, given that last season Odegaard scored 15 goals?
Peterl, the reason we are looking at FFP, is because MA has bought experienced players at sky high prices.
If we are struggling with these players, shouldn’t we be asking why – coach5tgem and make them earn their salaries?
At this rate, we’ll become another chelsea, believing that money solves everything.
I too question why the kids didn’t get a chance in the dead rubber champions league game, and it was brought to my attention, that game value approximately £2 mill.
Now that’s the equivalent to winning the FA cup.
So just maybe the gaffer was contemplating getting his hands on that £2 mill that he could use in the January window.
I haveeread ALL the avove posts and can see both sides, in SOME ways.
But I have to say that so far MA has proved resolutely againstproperly introducing ANY of the current crop of still young players , despite the previous evidnce of those now aged 21, 22 who were in the team at 18 and showing why.
My view is that as some of our key players are clearly overplayed and stale through overuse and as also we are not able to buy top rate players this window mainly because of FFP, then unless MA changes tack and DOES give some of our many talented youngsters AREAL CHANCE , THEN WE WILL PAY THE PRICE .
We still have such duds as Elneny and Soares in the first team squad while such as Patino are on loan.
To me that makes ZERO sense and I THINK IT A MISTAKE BY MA.
I wouldn’t be against E. Nwaneri playing ahead of Havertz in the odd home game just to see if he looks like a rounded midfielder. I think we’re missing a midfielder when Havertz is playing as he looks like he’s something in between a forward and a midfielder.
Also, depending on the opponents
I wouldn’t be against an academy fullback getting the left-back spot so long as he brings big energy into his game
Well, I have said it once before, the problem with Arsenal this season is all psychological. We have lost our conviction, our lethal belief and our execution in the box sucks. Always squaring the ball and even Odegaard shooting levels is down. And Arteta is to blame. By introducing Kai H in this team, he brought in a cancer and mentality that we did not have last season. Even Martinelli has lost confidence in hitting the ball to the net. The sad part is, Arteta has no clue that the attacking system is dying of this cancer, or is too proud to admit. Even if we bring in a new striker, it will not fix this problem. We need to go back to the mentality of last season, even if it means dropping Havertz until the mentality is back. We had a goal return without a top striker last season. There was a point in the season when entire team was trying to help Kai break his duck and the bloke was missing sitters until the Pen he was given. Bogey man in the mind. Goals on multiple fronts and players is our strength.
Introducing those players to a senior squad is not good, the players are still young , they can get injured and their career end, take a look at Welshare who suffers with injuries.