Don’t let the three points mask another bad performance by Konstantin Mitov
Well lovely Arsenal people, in the end it’s 3 massive points after some utterly shocking refereeing. That second yellow to Tomi was criminal, and Ayew had a much worse foul sitting on a yellow and nothing. I’m calling it for what it is, deliberate refereeing against us.
That said, our performance was poor. The Arteta experiment with Partey at right back just doesn’t work for me, and I’m worried it’s all just to fit a certain Kai Havertz into the side, and let’s be real, he really hasn’t set the world alight with his performances so far.
We’ve moved Gabriel who was arguably our best defender last season out of the side, moved Partey, the most important player of our midfield last season to right back, and I didn’t see anything in Havertz’s performances to indicate he deserves this.
I’m a firm believer that results eventually catch up to performances and this simply won’t do enough against a better team. We might get away with it against Fulham, but I’m worried long term.
Our squad in terms of players is second only to Man City right now, we should be doing better going forward. Apart from Eddie hitting the post, we created very few substantial chances and only scored due to some clever fast free kick taking.
I don’t like this setup of the team, and I’m worried the stubbornness of the manager will cost us again. Once Gabriel came on and Zinny later on, you immediately saw an improvement even though we were down to 10 already.
I think Arteta is just lucky Tomi will be out next week, so maybe we’ll see Zinny back in the side and stop this Partey RB nonsense, because our LB will do the inversion.
That said, the one positive from this performance was our defensive resilience. When we had to dig deep, we did it, even though the manager tried to sabotage the team again. Why are you subbing one of our quickest and most dangerous players in Martinelli, who also works hard to win the ball, when you are a man down, to keep on Havertz.
And I’m really not picking on our new German signing, it’s just baffling why we are doing it. Arteta is in his fourth year here and we’ve spent a fortune on his squad. The expectations set are to win trophies and challenge for the title.
That is the only standard he will be held accountable to this year. The Kroenkes dipped in their pockets for him like they haven’t done for any other manager, even Wenger. We should be playing better football, and we should be creating more chances with the abundance of talent we have.
It’s just about putting the best personnel that fits the system, or picking a system that fits the personnel we have. So far I’m not seeing the direction we are going.
Just don’t be fooled by the 6/6 points. We started like no other Arsenal team from before had last year, and still finished second. We must improve, starting with Fulham.
Konstantin
JustArsenal Show – NEO discusses Arteta’s tactical set up for Crystal Palace v Arsenal
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I agree MA is trying different tactics because he felt teams start understanding his last season tactics and most teams are prepared to nullify us. That’s been innovative not Sabotage imo.
Some sections of fans have got an agenda against Havart extending to the manager. The guy has just played 2 competitive games for us and in both games, he has had 6/10 performances imo.
Had Martinelli taken his shot earlier in the first 2min of the game Havart could have had an assist. And he was part of the team that managed the game with a man disadvantage for over half an hour.
Let’s enjoy the win and stop complaining
I don’t understand the need to defend everything at the expense of the club. You are Arsenal fans not Arteta and his signings. Havertz has been on the Premier League for 3 seasons already.
65M on fees and more than 300K wages gets you an impact player not a casual jogger!
LAST I CHECKED TROSSARD IS OUR PLAYER TOO AND THE ONE DESERVING DEFENDING THAN HAVERTZ because he actually contributes.
Some of you act like an election campaign committee of Arteta. Do you want Arsenal to win trophies or is Arteta sitting on the manager chair a trophy enough for some of you?
@HH , why do you assume you know more than Arteta? Th coach has gotten Arsenal where it is through his actions and we should give him & his new players time & support.
The unnecessary victimization of Havert after just playing 2 league games is uncalled for! he is Arteta player & most logical fans will support him & the coach till end of the season!
I can’t say he has gotten Arsenal where it is. What does that even mean? It is the owners who have backed him financially and have given him enough time and he has yet to repay any of those.
We should continue where we left last season but I see self sabotaging at work instead.
Self sabotage?
2wins in 2?
6points out of 6
Talk about continuing where we left it last season.
How else can we do that? We just won fam
City weren’t convincing at the beginning of last season alas, they were treble winners
Can we just hide these negative insecurities
U speak as if Arteta is infallible… And we are not victimising Kai just demanding more from such an expensive player who is taking the place of a proven performer in Trossard… The 2 performances so far of the team are clear for all to see.. A few ordinary plays here and there just don’t cut it at this level.. Why do people defend mediocrity so much
And you are right HH Trossard does produce but that doesn’t seem enough for hm.
Reggie, I agree with everything Konstantin has stated. How can anybody justify playing Thomas Partey at RB and weaken Arsenal’s best midfield of Odegaard, Partey and Rice, while not even including an intetnational RB in Kieran Tierney in the matchday squad? Breaking up the successful CB pairing of Saliba and Gabriel is unfathonable.
Heaven help Arsenal if they take the current lineup into matches with top sides domestically and in Europe
Apart of the Penalty Ode scored yesterday, could you tell me how he and Saka played better than Havert.
We are judging this player based on his time here not as a Chelsea player.
We all didn’t understand the signing of Havert we can only trust the manager, my point is: what has he done wrong?
The price tag is not his fault and Rice hasn’t given us £100m performance yet as well.
Why have an agenda just after 2 epl games?
The set up was seriously detrimental to Martinelli, Saka and Odegard’s game in all honesty and this is just to accommodate KH in order to prove a point by MA. No connection and understanding between Partey and Saka, same with Martinelli and Tommy, Odegard and KH. I thought new signings are to be eased in and not to bench your proven performers for them. I’m not the boss and I’ll keep supporting my team, but it can be painful honestly. Hope we don’t end up learning in a hard way.
Wow… U just said everything I wanted to say but better
My reply was actually meant for HH’s post.. U worded it so precisely
We will defend Arteta because he improved the culture of the club, the ambition of the club, the players of the club and now the results. He made that all possible. We hate the likes of you because you act as if you know better than Arteta while holding no substance or accountability. Probably you are here as a spy, a chalatan or a saboteur.
Exactly, i have seen the same Havert negativity on AFTV….Xakha is gone the new player ready for hate is Havert no-matter how he plays…..IF Arteta cannot integrate Havert vs Palace or other mid-table teams when do this people assume he ever will? Fingers closed am hopeful just like most doubted Arteta, Havert can pay back by quickly integrating to prove them wrong.
We all have our fingers crossed but so far, the fact is, he is proving not a good buy and NOT deserving of his place. All players should deserto play not play to deserve, that sends out the wrong message. If he deserved his place, there would be no debate.
True.
Just like Rice, Havert has done just what the manager requested of him. And he has done it well.
We all might not agree with MA new tactic, I personally want more from Havert as well, I want him to take the initiative and be more aggressive, yet I wouldn’t victimise him on the team lack of cutting edge or bad performance.
Trossard could have come on yesterday but for the red card. The game needed Havert more than Trossard after the red card
And how has he played? That is the issue. I repeat do not be a campaign member of Arteta. We have better players on the bench and the coach is a good tactician. He should not try to be too clever for his own good.
You are not the one to tell the coach not to be too clever. In fact none of us have the qualifications.
As far as his tactics are getting the job done, he is getting it right.
He bought all the players in our team, he has the right to pick whoever he thinks is right for the job at a particular time.
We as fans can only complain if the result aren’t what we expect.
The stats of the games are good, the brand of football is different from last season, what’s there to complain about?
Surely everyone is entitled to an opinion, whether you agree with it or not?
Some of us are concerned that Arteta is tinkering unnecessarily, without us understanding why? Personally I haven’t read any reasonable explanations on JA.
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Looks like some fans are stubborn idiots
I am totally against fans complaining, l complained bitterly about Zaka for several season , and you know what, he came really good. Please let us allow this man to settle down well in Arsenal. I thought he played well yesterday, and he his only going to improve. Yesterdays game going forward is a sign that we might just have that extra bit of luck this year.Lastly in my opinion, some of the referees in the premiership need to do extra workshop frequently.
Allow him to settle down you said… At the expense of winning something this season after ending second last season… Arteta should be building on the tactics that obviously worked for him last season not experimenting.
Let him give time to settle down.i totally agree with you, that’s why he should be gradually introduced to the team like most new signings.that’s what training is for,getting used to your teammates,tactics….
To be fair to MA it’s good that he is trying different things, but maybe try them once we are 3 – 0 up in a game and not at the start of a game at the start of the season. We won which is great, but we are not playing in a way that’s sustainable at all IMO.
I think we are trying to overcomplicate things to the point where it’s becoming illogical.
What I don’t like is forcing Havertz into the starting 11, he looks like he needs time to adjust so he should be coming off the bench. Players on the bench will be wondering why, if MA claims to play players on form, that the form players aren’t starting which is not good for team morale in general.
We have ManU, Spurs, City and Chelsea in our next 7 fixtures, we better pull up our socks quickly.
Onto the next game, COYGs
I don’t even understand what brought Trossard and Havertz together bcos Havertz replaced Grant Xaka. So how does it affect Trossard playing
Who said Havertz replaced Xhaka. Trossard is individually good especially with assists, but the team is more stable with Havertz jogging around and man marking Martin Ordegaard at times
Last season when many teams understood our playing tactics it’s when we started to lose or draw ; this is the reason why MA wants to make a team that is less predictable .we should support and trust the process.winning dirty it what make a team to have belief.
I think at the moment we are winning dispite of, instead of because of. That hopefully will improve because the changes are NOT at the moment making us a BETTER team. Things cant stay the same and im sure they wont. Two win and points wise an amazing start. Our start to the season is kind, we have to sort the problems by the time it gets serious. Haverz is causing all sorts of problems, the problem is, it is for US.
Havertz is not a problem, he is not the solution yet. That will come, he’s class !!
I will be glad when i see it and not keep having to be told it. He has been a ghost so far.
Didn’t read the article because of who penned it and his usual negativity, sorry. Anyway I think Partey played quite well at right back and quickly transitioned into midfield when we were moving forward. However, we definitely missed the attacking options with White at right back and his partnership with Saka, with either player getting to the line and crossing or cutting the ball back. One real positive from last night was the performance of Rice, the best player on the pitch.
Yes agree, we had zero overlapping runs with both fullbacks being played out of position. Partey did very well considering but when they counter attacked us you could see they targeted the open space which was vacant with Partey pulling into midfield. In possession it works well, against a quick counter it’s a big risk.
GB, a waste of a top midfielder in Partey, when Arsenal has other strong options at RB.
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A tactical oriented fan would’ve known that partey did not necessarily played as a RB but a DM, strange you see him as a RB in the game given the fact it is clearly obvious what his role was.
He played as in inverted RB, not as a DM, it is clearly obvious that that is what he played. I really dont understand and and as far as i am concerned, why anyone would want to mess about with one of the best midfielders in the world to fit in a player, who hasn’t sparked yet. There is a thing in my book that says you should earn things, not get preferential treatment. Haverz has got preferential treatment and i have not yet seen why. I dont see why Partey should be sacrificed his best role for somthat clearly is not setting the world on fire and i personally doubt it will on the evidence so far. But lets all hope it will be the thing that propells us to leagues winners and Haverz and Partey are vying for the players of the year awards for their outstanding performances in their respective roles. I wait with anticipation.
You only agreed with me by stating that he played as an “inverted RB” which means he drifts into the middle of the park from the right to execute the role of a DM according to our attacking details, not deprived of the role he’s excellent at you see?
No i didn’t agree, he should be midfield and just bossing that, not playing RB when required.
You do realize Partey played in that position from the end of last season? The gaffer is trying out new tactics to make the team more unpredictable so i don’t believe Kai is to be blamed for reconfiguration of players’ positions. However, I don’t think it’s a great idea as Partey dynamism in midfield is essential to enable quick progression of the ball. Playing RB mutes his influence on the pitch and is a waste of his talents. I noticed we found it more difficult to progress play when CP pressed high. I’m not overly worried tho cause I’m sure the gaffer sees the same issues and will either straighten them out or revert to a familiar tactic. Kai has not been flashy so far, but he brings something new to the team that is yet to be exploited. I expect him to come good. However, the gaffer has to figure out a way to give Trossard deserved minutes.
I share the same. I wonder when people will see that Partey is not RB, he plays DM and only drops deep right when defending. Our new game is based on transitioning through the middle so we hardly need overlapping fullbacks. We need quick and progressive passers from the back hence the absence of Gabriel, KT.
Our game play wasn’t pretty. But our tactic was very safe, because we include more tall players in the starting lineup for the set-pieces and our fullbacks didn’t overlap to defend against wing attacks
As for Havertz, he is supposed to be Xhaka’s/ Giroud’s replacement as our main lamp post to win aerial duels in the final-third and he did that to give our defense a breather when we played with ten men
No one will speak about how well Havertz relieved the pressure towards the end in the last two games to help Arsenal seal the win, using his aerial ability. If you forgot about his aerial duels and hold-up play against Man City in Community Shield game, watch the footage below, from 1:23 time:
youtube/watch?v=25hEhHBMNAQ
I dont know what game you watched but Haverz won virtually nothing inbthe air or on the ground. You were right though, his impersonation of a “lamp post” was spot on.
He won some aerial duels to give his teammates some time to regroup
He won 3 headers all game ,Martinelli won 4 from what I read .
Martinelli was a constant treat and made the penalty with his quick thinking and aways running back to help out but was taken off ,he was t happy and you can see why .
I agree 💯 % that Marti was angry. He gave his heart there.
I got later in the game that maybe he kept Havertz to get a few long balls from our defense and push the team up. Ok it has sense.
But frankly, nothing Martinelli can’t do and he’s way better at making other teams panick and bring something to the table. Havertz is still young at Arsenal, but he needs to show more will more hunger to this team.
Otherwise I don’t see why other benchers would not be better suited to make that team attack properly. Like Trossard, ESR (who has way more energy to give), …
You should’ve watched how Havertz/ Martinelli performed in aerial duels and how many times they got involved in the battles, instead of reading their stats from some gossip website
According to Who Scored, Havertz won four and Martinelli won two:
whoscored/Matches/1729203/LiveStatistics/England-Premier-League-2023-2024-Crystal-Palace-Arsenal
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Reggie,a casual search on the internet informed me that Havertz won 4 aerial duels against Palace. But I didn’t need the internet for that because I watched him win the duels. I can only assume your were asleep or distracted during those instances.
How many did he lose??????
I saw him ineffective and NOT winning duels.
Oh and if you are defending his performance, then we cant be in agreement because for me the truth is he is and has been underwhelming.
No Reggie,I was disproving,with actual evidence,the erroneous statement you made that he won virtually no aerial duels. In fact,Havertz had twice as many successful aerial duels as the next best Arsenal player(Saliba,White and Martinelli who each won 2 aerials).How you or I view his performance is a matter of opinion, not fact. Personally I don’t think he was outstanding, but neither do I think he was awful as he is being made out to be. Whoscored,a reputable site that uses various measurable parameters to rate players,rated Havertz at 6.75 which was higher than six of the 15 players who played for Arsenal against Palace . He also played one key pass which Martinelli did not convert. Never let a good or bad story get in the way of facts. Check Whoscored,Opta Stats or Oracle Cloud(which has a partnership with the EPL)to get your facts right.
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I read Saliba won 6 aerial duels!!!!!!!!
There is generally little point in arguing with Mr Reggie. He and certain others double down on their particular perspectives even when factually inaccurate.
Clearly, we would like to see more from Havertz but the caricature suggested by Reggie and his ilk is clearly misleading.
Whos arguing? I am stating a fact that one site will say one thing and another different. Im not arguing im debating and having an opinion. I dont call you out for your opinion and try to discredit you, so dont me.
You are stating opinions that lack credibility. It is clearly untrue that Havertz did not win any duels.
Your statements indicate that you disagree strongly with the views of others yet seem to be suggesting now that you are not arguing.
As for your last point, I’m afraid inaccuracies will be challenged.
@GAI, every season you get obsessed with one theory or the other, last season it was inverted left and right wingers, this season it’s tall players and set pieces, Arteta’s tactics is making Arsenal play an unattractive football, creating less chances and scoring few. He shouldn’t try this with United or even Chelsea, I don’t want want to mention City, we would be ripped apart.
We won against Man City in Community Shield game using the tactic and Havertz as the CF
We drew actually,we won on penalties
We drew not won and it was a preseason friendly.
When will fans ever be satisfied? We won two difficult matches yet, we resolved to judging the coach tactics. Havertz just played two games and in my opinion he scored 5/10.
That is fair for a player who just joined the club. This guy is new to Artet’a tactics
and the way Arsenal play compared to Chelsea. Let’s cut him some slacks.
Havertz shouldn’t be criticised for the cost of his signing he didn’t put the price on himself but Chelsea did. And that he didn’t perfom last season no Chelsea player did.
We fans should excercise patience Arteta and the Boys just played two game.
He was 65 mil, plays for Germany, played CL final, played for Chelsea in prem and should NOT need time to convince. He should be ready made for all that. He should be deserving of his place and he isnt. Thats all!!!!
@Reggie
RealTalk Reg. Kai is not an Academy prospect we’re waiting to come good. He’s a 65m ready made professional and should be expected to play as such…Jus sayin
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For your information, kia is playing in a new team, new position and in a tactics he hasn’t played in any of his previous clubs, from the reaction seems arsenal fans wants someone yo make a scapegoat this season and kia have become the victim, gadiola managed to beat palace 1_0 last season with a pk and everyone celebrated it. Hugson hasn’t lost a home game since his return yet we aren’t satisfied, what is the guarantees that arteta playing party in midfield, white at Rb and so on will get us the points?… The performances hasn’t been top notch yet we haven’t been outplayed either, we all expected the team to evolve this season yet wants everything to remain the same, I Wonder what the reactions will be if we had lost, pochetino played back 4 whole preseason and went unbeaten, yet started his league games with a back 3 and I didn’t see Chelsea fans whinnying this much, selhurst park is not an easy ground to go, many top teams will drop points there
Exactly, @Gun down:
If Havertz scored five goals in a match, some deluded folks will come here and angrily question why he didn’t make it half a dozen.
He is a raumdeuter – nothing he does will be highlight material on TV. The gaffer is pleased, we won both games, and that is what matters right now. Not the shrieks and wails of the baying mob.
Jurien Timber is also new to arsenal, without a premier league experience and also playing out of position. You will agree that we are missing him already and giving our choices would have preferred kai to have been injured in his place
What are you expecting from him as a CM that he is not doing?
Last night match made me worry a lot, because of this year 2023. FA rules and even the way the referees are administering the matches will put us in troubles. Arteta on the hand have to ”watch out” on how to make a perfect selection. playing Kai for 90 minutes will cost him a massive points more specially in big matches. I wish he should be consistent in selecting the players. But instead, he is always inconsistent. I don’t know weather he really watch the match and see which position need an improvement. like last night according to football analysis Gabriel materilleni wing was rated at 27% while Saka wing was rated 52% you that but he was not concerned about that. so, I was completely disappointed. And need Trossad to be brought it to help filling that position.
My eyebrows were also raised when I saw the lineup in the last two matches. Maybe he is conducting an experiment that he will make use of later in the season. It could also be he is just trying to fit Havert into the team (who knows). Nonetheless it was a significant three points. Whatever the case is may his decision of playing Party out of position not come back to hunt him. Because he has been given all he needs. Nothing but a trophy will be accepted from now henceforth.
Speculations. Firing threats. Orders. Ah, the life of an entitled fan.
You can’t fire Arteta; only the owners can – and they determine what he needs to do to keep the job.
Has it occurred to you that Partey has played right back before, but in this tactic he still plays primarily in midfield? The tactic is for low block teams, not for every team!
Must he play Partey @ RB for gods sake to accommodate kai. Can’t you see it’s hurting the partnership of sak n white? against city it was Trossard who came off the bench to rescue us with his creative play while kai was firing blanks at point blank range. What does Kai bring better than viera another needless buy. Arteta is just trying to justify is transfer blunder by foolishly fielding Kai.Why change a system that’s working?
Opps! Gunners please calm down. its the second game and am sure Arteta is still experimenting to test new players capability – IF he cannot try new system with Rice/Havert against Palace a mid-table team when will he??
As much as MOST Arsenal fans hated Havert signing, Arteta sees something in him & in the first 10-15 games he will try to unleash the beast that played in Germany and try to get him to learn our system as quickly as possible. Please we all should tone down the critism as am sure in tougher games vs Brighton/City/Pool/Man U/Chelsea we will go to a traditional Partey/Rice midfield & hopely have Jesus back upfront.
I just don’t get it
Changing how we play to fit in Havertz
He then ends up contributing nothing… And he can’t be subbed
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Kai Harvetz has played well in both games ,he doesn’t have to dribble people or be sensational to be effective …
Watch the game very well and notice that he was very useful in transition and in the flow as well as defending from the front.
Having different systems and showing flexibility based on the team we re playing is a plus for Arteta this season.
We have won 2 games without opponents creating not more than 2-3 clear cut chances in both games is a very good one.
Kudos Arteta and the team for yesterday,
Before now, against a palace side that have not lost at HOME since Hodgson took over,we will have drawn that game or even lost it .
Am not happy with our first 11 how can start with Thomas on right wing while we have Gabriel and second out line next game we need to change this
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B4 now we would lose which game? We won at selhoust park last season 2-0. Of all quality players available is it Kai that was needed for change of systems? Is Kai in the midfield better than Partey/Rice/Odegard combination? Which transition are u talking about? A player that Chelsea fans were wishing away from the squad .Yet you want to justify a substandard performance because Arteta bought him .
I am not a big fan of playing Partey as a RB. It feels to me that we are trying to be too cute with our tactics.
If we insist on playing Havertz why not try him with Trossard next game? I don’t think there is a natural connection between Martineli and Havertz.
I was also not a big fan of taking most of our forwards out after we went down to 10 man. Last night it worked, but we invited so much pressure sine we were no longer a threat going forward, and we had no outlet or chance to play on the counter.
Great result and lets hope we don’t see Partey as a RB against better teams.
Last night match made me worry a lot, because of this year 2023. FA rules and even the way the referees are administering the matches will put us in troubles. Arteta on the hand have to ”watch out” on how to make a perfect selection. playing Kai for 90 minutes will cost him a massive points more specially in big matches. I wish he should be consistent in selecting the players. But instead, he is always inconsistent. I don’t know weather he really watch the match and see which position need an improvement. like last night according to football analysis Gabriel materilleni wing was rated at 27% while Saka wing was rated 52% but he was not concerned about that. so, I was completely disappointed. And need Trossad to be brought it to help filling that position.
“The Arteta experiment with Partey at right back just doesn’t work for me, and I’m worried it’s all just to fit a certain Kai Havertz into the side”
But arteta started playing him RB at the back end of last season – I’d be surprised if havertz was in the thinking that far back, but i suppose anything’s possible.
I’m normally one who worries about poor performances, but i really haven’t found the first two games to be concerning. I think every game in the EPL is a tactical battle these days, and it’s all about pressing. I think arteta has got that part of the game right in both games so far – even if we haven’t been at our fluid best in attack throughout the matches, we’ve really strangled the opposition and made it tough for them to get anything going at all.
On another day, Eddie scores one or both of his earlier, well-crafted chances, and/or we don’t have a red card to contend with, and the game looks completely different.
And havertz has been massively important to our pressing game. He’s had a couple of decent moments, but yes, he does need to find a way to have more of an influence. Hopefully something will go his way and he’ll start to kick on, but he’s not hurting the side with his presence so far.
Thought rice was immense yesterday as well – very impressed with his energy and defensive nouse.
Oooolala! We might agree Havertz puts in a debate. And my feeling is that so far he gives me a low satisfying one.
I am not thrilled at the game I saw last night. Last year, I was overhap’y with the sense of movement of the team etc …
Kaï has to step up his mindset, he looks like he is unhappy to many times with mood gestures, he might bring in some great moves, but he needs to level up his stamina.
We are happy with the three points, but the pitch of the game wasn’t to be 10 man and leading by a goal only.
That said, Hodgkin & the Eagles showed they are no joke to beat.
About Arteta, I think he has some weird management decisions. He needs to trust more his bench, they are like warriors looking at a fight and he uses them too narrowly. Bring on Reiss, try Balogun vs Sheffield Utd, Start Trossard and then put Havertz … and what about ESR ???
So on, I wish we start an offensive game next time with the creativity of last year.
I find it ridiculous to claim that the manager sabotaged the team considering he arguably has the most to lose if the team doesn’t do well- his job! While I concede that the tactics we’ve seen in the first two games have not created the most chances,I appreciate MA’s willingness to try things different. There were complaints last season regarding predictability and what not. It baffles me why many people are so opposed to something they were yearning for just a few weeks ago – variation in tactics within/between games.
While many people are quick to point out the fallibility of the coaches, they project an air of infallibility. If the manager doesn’t set up the team as they desire,then the manager must be wrong(sometimes stubborn, vindictive, rookie etc). I think Arteta mistakes and he himself has admitted to this. But as you entertain that thought that the manager made mistakes with his tactics/selections,you should also embrace the idea that you could be mistaken/wrong in your assumptions,analysis and conclusions on the same- that is self awareness.
Finally,I think the flak Havertz is getting is over the top and it doesn’t really help the team. It looks like he’s the new scapegoat. It seems to me like everything bad he does is magnified by his detractors while anything good he does is minimized to suit their narrative. A good example is one of the comments here made to the effect of Havertz winning zero duels which is just false and pathetic to be honest. You only have to watch highlights on YouTube to confirm that he won multiple aerial duels.
Mr Onyango we were complaining last season about arsenal being predictable.Did we say that Kai was the solution or if you were asked to make a choice as to the solution to that predictability problem would u av suggested Kai by a long shot? Don’t justify a transfer blunder and tactical nativity by that narrative. Yea we complained, BUT we didn’t ask for Kai , a player Chelsea fans were wishing away from their squad NO we didn’t sir. Why you are defending Kai with epl experience when Timber without one is doing excellently I don’t understand.
Well that’s very close minded to say MA is sabotaging the tactics.
One of the many reasons we missed out on the title last season was predictability, but now we criticize him because he’s trying new things?
What makes this criticism even more laughable is that it’s yielded 2 wins from 2, a clean sheet, and domination in both games (until the red card against Palace).
It’s great MA has done this early and seen that it works, because this gives him the option to switch tactics and formation ingame, knowing that it works.
I would imagine that having more options available makes life tougher for opposing managers to set up their team.
It’s bizarre that some Arsenal fans want us to stay predictable.
You pointed out something important Jen. We were dominant in both games until something unexpected happened- the injury to Timber and the Tomi red card. The two events impacted both games but the team was able to adapt. The outcomes for both games might have been different if not for the two losses.
When we lost Saliba n Tomiasu last season and had to make do with Rob holding , it didn’t immediately reflect in our games until Liverpool, Westham , Southampton and then we started losing games. We don’t need to start loosing b4 we complain about an obvious tactical self sabotage that will cost us later
Nothing wrong with Partey playing right back, but saying Arteta is experimenting so Haverts will get use to the system is funny, why do they train daily then?
The fact is: Arteta is trying to justify Haverts acquisition though Trosard does better.
Must we begin to loose points against palace/forest before we know things aren’t working
Bro Havertz was selected ahead of trossard because he needs a player like havertz in that position not a smaller player like trossard.last time I checked we dominated and won the games you claimed “things aren’t working”.
I don’t understand you, while Kai was underperforming @Chelsea last season were we not winning games? What is Kai doing in his position that was not done last season that gunners were winning matches?. For gods sake Chelsea fans were lamenting about Kai’s performance last season and he’s playing the same way now and you are wondering why we shouldn’t complain. Trossard even came on to rescue us against city while Kai was could not slot in a simple ball right in front of the post.
I absolutely dont like the idea of Partey as RB, whether inverted or not. Tomi is our ideal RB along with White. Gabriel and Saliba are our first choice defenders. If Zinchenko is injured, Tierney is our LB. Why this tinkering with a working system. I cant see Havertz contributing greatly to the team specially in possession. Hope Arteta restores normalcy and normal service resumes once Zinchenko is back. Also, Trossard in place of Nketiah and ESR in place of Havertz.
I would be happy to see that team selection.
Cheap talk, @gunnerforlife:
What working system? The one that was found out at the end of last season?
You can scream till the cows come home – the manager plans to use the players he sees daily in training with a tactic designed to destabilize the opponent. He is not going to play an anti-low block tactic against non-low block teams like Man City [remember the Comm Shield?] and Man United, for example.
Be patient – the team is evolving and unpredictability is the name of the game now, and how wonderful that is!
There is clearly an agenda against the manager and Havertz as the title of the piece and many of the comments demonstrate.
To claim that Arteta “sabotaged” the setup is one of the most graceless headings for an article that I have seen.
We have won our two first games with the new set ups whilst dominating the games and having to cope with injuries and other issues.
The setups have been quite effective in restricting the opposition so far and still allow us to create chances. Some of the players are still getting to terms with the approach and our play has not been as fluid as we would like but it is still early days.
Havertz is new to the team and has yet to be as influential as he needs to be. However, the negativity that has been directed at him has been excessive.
There are a number of fans on this site that have been particularly vitriolic and really need to pipe down.
“Really need to pipe down !”
Hilarious 😂 😂
So what your saying is ,we may as well all shut our traps because we ain’t allowed an opinion if it does not suit you .
“Pipe down “
(Lols)
A very invalid opinion attacking what is clearly successful.so yeah it’s best to shut your traps.
“Shut your traps “
🤣🫡
Its called respect DK, or lack of for opinions. Not uncommon on here.
👍Particularly with some of the derogatory terms to describe posters, with whom they disagree. A lack of civility shown.
There’s no agenda against Kai as much as there wasn’t an agenda by Chelsea fans who were grumbling about his game. Jurien Timber is without epl experience and playing out of position yet is our best buy. Kai is playing the same way he was playing that Chelsea fans were complaining b4 he left, he’s a flop. We can try new tactics with nelson and ESR any Trossard as well. Arteta is justifying is transfer blunder and it’s self sabotaging.
Tomi A, the coach runs practice and decides on the system on match day. The point here is Partey is played out of position, Trossard and Gabriel are sacrificed and all that is done to accommodate Havertz in the team. Arteta knows it’s critical to play Partey, but wants Rice in DM at the same time. We are getting to a point where we will wish Havertz some kind of bad luck. It’s frustrating really.
I already am wishing he picks up a knock…. Sorry I don’t mean to sound heartless but that’s the level of frustration right now
Like seriously?? You two are something else!
Havertz is a bigger talking point than Partey imo, the latter of whom plays RB about 10% of the game with the rest of the time sharing the deep-lying DM role with Rice.
I thought Havertz started brightly and did very little wrong, his movement just doesn’t chime with our style of play which prevents him from getting involved in the game. While I do believe he’ll become an important and productive player, I think it sends the wrong message to bench players if he isn’t rotated. ESR or Trossard should start in his place next game and Zinnie has to come back in at LB.
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣… Just told myself to come read some opinions here, and I wasn’t disappointed 🤣🤣🤣🤣…
The day I come on here and there’s nothing negative, I will go on a one month dry fast 🤣🤣🤣…. Seems like all the negative and fairweather fans are gathered here and on AFTV.. 🤣🤣🤣
Winning the League and even the Champions league, will only satisfy these ones for just that day, the next day, they will resume with their negativity.
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣let 🤣🤣me add 🤣🤣🤣🤣a few more 🤣🤣🤣🤣emojis 🤣🤣to give 🤣🤣your post 🤣🤣🤣the desired 🤣🤣🤣effect 🤣🤣🤣it truly 🤣🤣🤣deserves 🤣🤣🤣🤣
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣💪💪💪💪💪💪💪🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Haha
Post of the year so far😂😂😂
@Alan, !00%!
I will join you in that fast – but frankly, the chances of that day happening is like waiting for Godot 🙂
I am totally against fans complaining, l complained bitterly about Zaka for several season , and you know what, he came really good. Please let us allow this man to settle down well in Arsenal. I thought he played well yesterday, and he his only going to improve. Yesterdays game going forward is a sign that we might just have that extra bit of luck this year.Lastly in my opinion, some of the referees in the premiership need to do extra workshop frequently.
It’s an ugly win, but its these kinds of wins that make us big jug contender.
Surely Havertz inclusion is resulting in some of these radical changes ,
and am not betting on it not been used against Fulham on Saturday, barring the Ukrainian coming in.
Something no one has talked about is the Odegaard penalty. I think it’s the right decision moving forward to have him as our substantive penalty taker. I like Saka and he’s one of our best players but I find his penalties unconvincing so far – ditto Jesus. Jorginho obviously is an excellent option too.
We controlled that game from start to finish the only downside was our forwards not being on fire. I can’t wait til Jesus returns because the link-ups are better when he’s out there. As for Havertz, he should have had a beauty of an assist and it’s not his fault that all our forwards failed to convince. It was an ugly win the best sides do this away from home so I’ll take it as a good omen for now. As for Partey tactics, it’s just us doing the one inverted fullback but from the other side of the pitch so it’s not totally new to us
One more thing I think our passing needs to be quicker and I expect that to happen as we’re building confidence with these wins
We already have Trossard for that but he is somehow not being played
I think partey playing at right back was because of the injuries to Zinchenko and Timber who are the only ones in this team who does that better than the rest from that lb/rb role.
Although Zinny is just returning from injury and needs time to get back to full match sharpness.
I think the coach knows what he is doing in persisting with this tactics, and I also know partey will return back to midfield now that Zinny has gotten some minutes.
My only worry yesterday was the substitution of Nelli and Eddy which to me was the wrong move when you are ten man down and will need an outlet.
I hoping Arteta will learn from the effect of that change prior to when Zinny, kiwior and Gabriel came in
So many chronic whiners on here!! How can fans be this bitter after a convincing win despite ending the game with 10 men is beyond imagination. Sickening really.
Theres only you whining the rest is debate and opinion. Im not whining or upset just highlighting what i thought.🤔
And most of the “whining” has been about Haverz which i think is fully justified given the whole picture. I dont think that has anything to do with the win or score?
👍👍👍
They blindly agree with whatever the manager does when it’s a norm for managers to want to play there expensive transfers to justify there choice in transfer market
Blind eh? We’ll see who is the blind eventually.
No! You and your like literally expressed your frustrations on our new tactics and havertz place in the starting line up which is way over the top given we are doing great except the lower chances created and our forwards clinicality which I’m confident will improve with time as teams are forced to show us respect by sitting deep to avoid being annihilated and allows us to express and impose our game. The tactics and selections are clearly working albeit on a lite level and can only get better so the over the top criticism is totally unwarranted.
It was my our opinion. What on earth is your problem with other people’s opinions. Are you that shallow you cant respect it?
“Convincing win”, we were all praying for the referee to blow the whistle and that was a convincing win to you.
As for Haverts, we aren’t saying he isn’t good enough or won’t come good, but why play him ahead of people inform when the ‘dont complain people’ are suggesting he’s yet to settle into the team. Why not introduce him into gradually
And what threat were palace able to pose after we were one man short?? I found the game so boring after Tomi’s red cos we were unable impose our game afterwards and palace dominance look amateurish compared to ours which goes to show how special we are and as for your question on havertz refer to my reply to you above.
Vamos, a total misreading of the game. Our forwards not being able to create changes is not a positive and Nketian and Harvertz will be disastrous against teams playing team. Lack of talent speaks for itself.
Vamos, “chronic whiners”, let alone “bitter”, when Arsenal has 2 wins from 2 games. But differences in opinion are not to be tolerated?
The impression you look to give, is terrible. An obscure way to look at things for the trully objective minds. We played well and controlled the game against a very good palace side at their very intense home ground. What else is your problem!
“I’m a firm believer that results eventually catch up to performances and this simply won’t do enough against a better team.”
Like Konstantin,so am I!
scores do not always fairly reflect games/performances and it works both ways,you can win without playing well and lose doing so and right now our performances/tactics do not fill me with confidence.i remember AW saying he didn’t like to bring too many new players at once because it disrupted the squad harmony, cohesion..right now I’m afraid that playing certain players out of positions,benching players who deserve to start(ie: Gabriel,Trossard) while insisting on playing those not up to our standards just yet might end up having a negative effect on our squad.having said all that,I really hope that I’m wrong!
“I really hope that I’m wrong” = I WILL NEVER ADMIT THAT I WAS WRONG.
I wonder what your so-called standards are, Mr. Arsenal Owner.
First of all they are not my standards but the team’s.are you seriously saying that right now Have Ritz is on the same level as our first XI from last season and his teammates this season.as for my “I hope I’m wrong”it means exactly that, believe it or not i want the best for the team.i also do not suffer from insecurity or the likes…meaning I have no problems admitting being wrong.
Another spectacular article from Mr Constantly whining Mikov.
I bet if we end up winning the league this season, the 1st article headline will be Arsenal win the league despite Arteta best efforts
Arsenal went to a tough Palace ground and got 3 points. And we absolutely dominated them until the red card. And we defended everything Palace threw at us until the end. The setup of the team is to win as a team, not as a platform for players to shine individually. If we played fantastic and lost, there’s a problem. If we played bad and won, there’s a problem. If people think opponents don’t take note of Arsenal last season and let us roll them over in matches, maybe it’s time they go find something else to do. The constant stupidity and the arrogance of being one is getting a bit tired for the rest of us to bear.
What ever opponents observed about our strength last season, Kai is not
the solution to change of tactics, Kai is a great misfit for midfield, he was a player that Chelsea fans complained about last season why should he be any better at arsenal? Kai is not the answer.
Well here I am at the bottom of the comments again.
Still I will put forward my opinion of yet another mistake Arteta is making.
Last season, when we faced corners and/or free kicks into the box, it was Gabriel who was the player to head the ball away. Saliba is not good with his head at those set pieces!!!
Just another oversight from our illustrious leader.