ARSENE WENGER LOSING OUT IN THE PL BY NOT KEEPING UP WITH NEW TACTICS AND MORE INFOMED COACHES? LET’S TAKE A LOOL AT THE FACTS!
I read a recent article on Justarsenal, which said that while AW was our most successful manager, he fell behind in his later years by failing to keep up with modern tactics.
So, I decided to find out who these clubs with such managers actually were and how they had affected Arsene Wenger’s results in the PL.
Some really interesting facts came too light while I was checking out these details and here they are for those who are interested.
Since the formation oof the PL, a total of fifty clubs have been involved, right up to Luton Town this coming season.
Only five of those clubs have been in the PL since its formation, The Arsenal, Man Utd, Chelsea, Liverpool and the spuds.
During that time, the top four places in the PL have been contested by just fourteen clubs.
Everton, Norwich, Forest, Leicester (once) Villa (2) Leeds Blackburn (3) spuds (7) City (13) Liverpool Chelsea (19) The Arsenal (22) and Man United (26 times).
So I started to look where, exactly, Arsene lost his way amongst the top four elite clubs and who they were., having said I would go back to the 2004/05 season for clarification, so here they are, in order of their finishing places, with any new and upcoming clubs threatening The Arsenal in capitals. I’m assuming there will be many in Arsène’s “declining years”!?
Chelsea, Arsenal, Utd, Everton
Chelsea, Utd, Pool, Arsenal
Utd, Chelsea, Pool, Arsenal
Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal, Pool
Utd, Pool, Chelsea, Arsenal
Chelsea, Utd, Arsenal, SPUDS
Utd, Chelsea, CITY, Arsenal
City, Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea
Utd, City, Chelsea, Arsenal
City, Pool, Chelsea, Arsenal
Chelsea, City, Arsenal, Utd
LEICESTER, Arsenal, spuds, City
Chelsea, spuds, City, Pool
City, Utd, spuds, Pool
Just THREE clubs threatening the dominance of The Arsenal, Utd, Pool and Chelsea? Surely not?!?!
Quite amazing really, when you think that, until the Russian roubles arrived in 2005, Chelsea hadn’t won anything for ages, while City were a distant memory until the oil money arrived in barrel loads, while of course Utd , as always, spent big because they had always outspent everyone for decades… .Meanwhile, we were hamstrung with the cost of building the new stadium and the emergence of Mr Kroenke, who told us that, under his regime, the club would have to be self-sufficient and had no intention of spending money to help win trophies… rather the opposite, as it was soon made very clear that any player with a transfer value needed to be sold.
No surprise then, when City with their newfound wealth raided our club on a regular basis, and we saw them become a normal feature in the top four…but they didn’t knock us out of the top four, even with Pep in charge.
So how did this affect our performances then?
Well it seems that some of our fanbase saw this as the start of Arsene losing his way, not spending the money that Kroenke wasn’t giving him and/or spending it on players who weren’t good enough and the decline of this great man thus began… because other clubs and managers were outthinking him etc etc… patently not true, judging by the end of season results!!
Also, when one actually looks at the PL top four table, there is no evidence whatsoever of other teams breaking into that elite top four on a regular basis (bar City for obvious reasons) is there?
Arsene carried on, season after season, and without any support from the owner, to produce teams that defied logic…if one believes what some of our fans keep saying.
How on earth could any manager, supposedly losing his grip, not spending money, spending money on players who were not good enough, living in a time bubble warp, losing his top players on a regular basis to his nearest rivals, seeing other clubs moving forward while he stagnated, POSSIBLY keep our club in the top four?
Simple really, he was a genius, a magician, a one-off man who, even in his penultimate season, missed the top four yet again by just one point, while winning the FA cup for the 7th time!!!!!!!
But that’s when he should have resigned in my opinion and I so regret that he didn’t go out in a blaze of further glory.
Did he make mistakes? Yes of course he did. Stay too long? Yes of course he did. Change the face of The Arsenal worldwide? Yes of course he did. Deserve the abuse of so-called Arsenal fans, both personal and for the job he was doing? Of course, he didn’t and it’s a stain on our fanbase that this ever happened – I just hope that his choice to succeed him, Mikel Arteta, is never targeted by this section of our supporters.
Finally, I’ve been called a troll by suggesting that The Arsenal might have been relegated if Wenger hadn’t done such a masterful job and that they were or are too big a club to be relegated.
I guess I’m a troll then…a 78-year-old lifelong Arsenal troll, who remembers the time before Arsene transformed our club into the worldwide name it is today.
ken1945
If he could keep up with modern tactics, he would’ve won more than two EPL trophies. 22 years at the same club is a long time to do that
Simeone won two La Liga titles with his dinosaur tactics in ten years, despite the dominance of two super-rich clubs in Spain
So your ignoring the different facts that were happening from Chelsea and Abramovitch onwards then?
Did Simeone have the same scenarios?
Simeone had it worse with Real Madrid and Barcelona, that had been very dominant before he managed Atletico Madrid
He won 3 EPL titles
GAI, check out what Atletico Madrid have been doing during and after their new stadium was being built.
Meanwhile, The Arsenal had City, Chelsea, United and Liverpool to contend with.
He won three epl trophies!
Wenger has been against buying already made players to supplant players that comes through his developmental program….
Gathering already made players to form a team is not modern tactics . In Facts it’s a lazy tactics. If he wanted it he would have done that with full support of the club’s hierarchy.
Why do we have financial fair play rule ?
Kudos for his proficiency in the face of all the monies thrown into the ‘modern’ game by other clubs wenger has made Arsenal fc a force to recon with; financially, organizationally technically and even tactically in the same ‘modern’ game….
None of these so call modern managers would have achieved the same fits as he has with the same budget and players…
Arsene Wenger would have achieved same if not surpassed other managers if he was in Real Madrid, Barcelona, etc at the same time…
Just look their European/Uefa champion league campaigns till the final in Paris that year not loosing a single match. If VAR were in place then may be we will not be talking like this. Please don’t and we cannot forget the invincibles in the same ‘modern’ game……
The Emirates stadium will forever be a testimonial to his stewardship in England and to the football culture.
He is a phenomenal in the game of football he came, saw and still conquering.
FIFA was wise, see his infuence and impart on the game in his current role at FIFA.
I will love to see him return to football management soon even for two years either at club side or national team.
He’ was born to Coach Arsenal fc little wonder they named him Arsene!
Merci boku professour.
Well said Ekayi
Premier league far stronger than la liga.
Arsene kept us top 4 while losing star players.
Thierry Cesc etc.
And oversaw The Emirates which is the reason where we are today
he won 3 EPL.
If we had been able to keep all our players and had a proper director of football someone who cared and tried his best to bring results as Arsene had tried his best then our history would be so much richer in my opinion. And I kinda like the way Arsene at his worst was able to bring in cup success while at his best he was simply Invincible
As soon as David Dean left as our football director, we lost our way and became a selling club. As far as I’m concerned, AW is a genius till they kingdom come…. Cheikina
I know this is in response to an article that was posted, but why does this matter now? Can’t we remember how great he was for the club and understand that towards the latter years the whole club needed a reboot, not just the manager?
The main issues I saw from him and the club was not offering the right bids to the players they wanted (Suarez Release Clause +1) and never really addressing the DM position after Song went to Barcelona.
Someone will hop on here and pinpoint everything that went wrong, But from my memory there were solid defensive pairings in Mert and Kos. The attack was strong for years, but they tended to get bullied in the midfield.
The Suarez release clause was a red herring and always used by the media to hammer arsenal and wenger! The facts are that Liverpool lied about the suarez release clause, which could have been proven in court and arsenal could have forced the sale, but the player didn’t want to do that, neither did arsenal, but they did trigger the release clause with their bid, fact!
Luis Suarez wanted to join Arsenal, he told every willing listening hear at time that he would join Arsenal after he returned from his holidays.
This information was very strong in the South, but Arsenal didn’t showed the conviction, it was even harder to take having given Man United the big jug on a platter the previous year with Van Persie.
In my opinion the legendary Frenchman should have thrown in the towel immediately after 2014.
I can understand the fact that asene wasn’t funded,left alone the fact that he brought out the genius in so many players (Henry,van persie,veira, fab,wallcot,just a few)which we lack as of now,only a few (mattnelli, saka,odegaard).just give asene d credit.the grea8test arsenal manager.much respect.
Thank you for the analysis,AW is not failure but master tactician who kept in premier league even without the cash to compete in the transfer market. Arsene Wenger should be seriously praised and being insulted
You missed out Everton they were there when premier league was formed. So it’s 6 teams not 5
Steve my apologies – I had them written down, but I waa checking so many facts, I missed them out.
Thanks you.
Think the legendary Frenchman lost his mojo half way through his tenure.
That hunger and driving force was just not there, key example, was when he had the chance to sign Luis Suarez in 2013.
Had Wenger went about acquiring Suarez with more conviction of a £55 mil bid, there is a very strong chance we would have won the league that year.
Selling Van Persie to your main rival was becoming too much for even the most ardent fan to take. He simply stuck in his old ways believing kids and untested players could win him much.
Gunsmoke, the club offered him a new contract, but he refused to sign it.
*Wenger was a great manager. A minority will dispute this. He had some great ideas and a vision of how the game should be played which he was able to realise at Arsenal for a time.
* Is he a genius? More difficult to determine. Consistently being able to reach the CL demonstrated a certain level of effectiveness. Does it equate to genius? Personally, I don’t believe he is even though he brought some clever ideas to the PL. The way certain teams demolished Wenger’s Arsenal and the limitations of his later teams will always be an issue.
Certainly, his methods worked to an extent otherwise we wouldn’t have made the top four for so long. But genius level. Not so sure.
*The issue around spending will also always be controversial where Wenger is considered. The limitations in MF hung around the club for several seasons and it is difficult to agree with Wenger’s view that he could not find players who could strengthen his squad.
*Did he pick Arteta to succeed him? I would like to see evidence of where and when he did this. My understanding was that he simply stated that Arteta had all the qualities to succeed him if he was the club’s choice.
Regarding your last point you require evidence because you are on Arteta camp so it’s a blow if it’s the truth. But you accept everything without evidence.
I have noticed pro Arteta and anti Wenger are same people.
Your last point HH is absolutely without foundation
Unfortunately some are just like we have pro wenger who are anti arteta and same for pro emery. I wonder on which side you are🧐
I can’t get how people put their fanboyism for coach or players above the club but i guess it’s just built in human dna.
I am pro Arsenal. I love Wenger and appreciate what he has done for the club. I support Arteta but I don’t appreciate what he has done for the club which going into his 5th season is nothing.
Considering investment and patience he has been given so far trophies are required. Last season was a great start and I expect more or the same going forward. He is capable of that.
You are not Arsenal pro,but Wenger pro.your comments since you joined this blog says so.you always defends Wenger,but criticize another guys that always defends Arteta
Wenger left and I am still here?
I criticize them for defending him unnecessary. Just the other day they jumped to defend him when nothing critical has been said about him.
Where we are going they are going to defend him even when he is praised.
HH
you too always defending Wenger, you need to accept when people do the same with Arteta
My wrong wording David, he suggested to the owner that Mikel would be a great choice – thanks for pointing that out as well.
Arsene was the first one to hire data based analytics regime, so much so we ended up the company itself. just one example he was quite abreast of times. He was dreamer, a believer and an achiever. He was let down by the hierarchy, fan base stoked by tabloids and on rare occasions by his players.
i personally think AW worked wonders on achieving what he did with what he had.
he will go down as the best manager we have had since Chapman. weather it was a lack of funding, friction with certain members of the board or being stubborn in not mixing up his play as he had his principles and stuck to it, we will never know.
he did stay to long but he should have been moved up stairs when it finally came to an end to retain his knowledge and love for the club and for that i think we handled it badly
he was always on par tactically with the others but unfortunately we had inferior players at times to carry out the plan or kill off games when we should have been running away with it
i, like ken do remember the managers before AW and the club was going backwards or at the best, static
forever grateful for all the great memories he gave me
in my my mind AW will always be king as he sacrificed everything for the club, loved the club during his reign, still loves the club after his reign and gave us some of the most unbelievable moments and memories in our football history that we as arsenal fans can cherish for ever and a day
thank you mr AW
A very generous piece about AW, Allanball08.
No Arsenal manager in my lifetime has surpassed him
You are doing an excellent work with these Wenger articles Ken to aid the general public from lies, fake news misinformation and twisted facts against the great Arsene from the haters (actual meaning of the word).
The usual suspects and they will pop here soon (one already has) will come with the usual twisted facts and misinformation.
Why do they bother to go to such lengths? Because they know the truth that’s why.
For Ken
I have to disagree on when he should have left. In my view it was 2014 after the Ist FA cup after a decade of no trophies as I felt he lost his sparkling touch between 2014 – 2018.
Greatest Arsenal manager during my time of supporting from 1979 till date.
Greatest achievement of AW: Keeping us in the CL top 4 places between 2005 and and 2014 as others had caught up with him (when he was a trailblazer from 1998 – 2005) and they had greater funding. This tends to get overlooked. I remember Mourinho stating his greatest achievement was getting Man Utd to finish 2nd despite the trophies he won.
2nd greatest achievement was the invincible season.
To me the Ist double was the one that was etched in my memory.
Indian Gunner London, yes, I get your point re. the 2014 cup final and that also makes a lot of sense… but be it 2014 or 2018, the truth is Arsene stayed too long for his own good.
Another article by the wenger worshipper for whom the man could do no wrong. One other parrot has already come to pat his buddy on the back.
Wenger will go down as one of the greatest managers ever, that’s why he is getting a bloody statue but no amount of fact twisting bs you spew will convert people to a worshipper like you.
As usual anyone who disagree with you guys will be called a hater.
When it comes to Wenger and Ozil (Shirt Selling Genius). There is no point. No objectivity is permitted with those two.
Will argue all sorts or minutiae that does not address or change the elephant in the room.
The vast majority of those two individuals flaws and fragilities at Arsenal were not of their own doing. It was always some else’s or something else’s fault as to why they both ended up the way they did.
Etc..
😊
Ackdshay, your wekcine to your point about my views, but hiw about pointing out where the results show Wenger kisr the plot and forward thinking clubs and their coaches took over?
It’s s easy to rant and rave, but coming up with concrete facts, seems a little to much for you.
I guess until anyone can match what Wenger achieved at our club ?
Remember many called 5th progress last season
That’s what Wenger was doing at his worse
And I know, like me Dan, you hope MA does just that.
“Wenger will go down as one of the greatest managers ever “
Then proceed to whinge when a life long fan tries to support said person against other fans putting him down ,couldn’t make that up ,like HH said there is definitely a pro Arteta and negative Wenger camp ,same 7-8 posters everyday day of the week .
Before you comeback with some silly childish attack calling me an Arteta hater I wanted Wenger gone myself ,so save yourself the bother ..
Pat you deleted my comment calling Goonster a liar that he is with evidence of his false accusation but this is still up.
Thats exactly the reason why i dont acknowledge or read his posts. He has a massive problem with twisting and lying to try to disprove or prove anything that doesn’t fit his narrative. And a sick way of trying to knock your opinion or what you have been told. A bit sad really. Still enough good posters on here not to have to worry too much.
I agree 100 % Reggie.
He mocked one poster calling his comment an essay because it was long whereas his own comments are manuscript in themselves.
Ackshay, try and read my third from last paragraph if you will.
No need to apologise afterwards – we all make mistakes.
It seems like any objective person can acknowledge/ accepts that wenger had been left behind hence why he was not taking us anymore farther than just keeping in the 4th place is like a trophy mentality. He had levelled up. And that’s okay because that’s how life goes. You can’t stay young forever. New ideas / younger people will take over and try to change the status quo to suit their times.. There is nothing to be ashamed of to acknowledge that wenger had had his time and refused to adapt to the ever changing football trajectory. His ideas had been cracked and mastered by many of his abled opponents and he was not changing his style.
EDU’s comments on how he thought he found the club:
“A club like Arsenal, at our size, is not building to be fighting for fourth place. I’m sorry.”
“We have to realistic — there’s City, Liverpool etc — that’s fine, I accept that. But also, you can not accept that. Here, when you join this club, when you see our size, we cannot accept it.
“That’s why I was really really hurt when I arrived. I said, ‘That’s not the mentality of this football club. What’s happening? Everybody’s comfortable, everybody’s ok, ok, ok…’ F*** you, “ok”! “Ok”?! No, I don’t want to lose games! We have to be there again.
“And I want to see the physios, I want to see the scouting, I want to see everyone with that kind of feeling, where you say, “F***ing hell, now we are going to really go for things”. And I think we are changing. Again, it doesn’t happen overnight, but I think we are changing and putting some good mentality in the squad. Characters.”
Very interesting – I didn’t know edu had that fire in him still. Hope it’s true – something seems to be working better since he joined, along with arteta
I don’t think AW was losing his grip as such but rather there was a new generation of managers staking their claim with more clubs entering the mix with owners who brought greater investment.
I am absolutely not anti Arsene Wenger who gave his blood, sweat and tears to the club but I do recognise that the last handful of years were looking less than certain that a top4 finish was a given. We were being pushed closer by those emerging teams and their more ambitious owners and answers didn’t seem to be forthcoming
Moving away from AW to the Arteta era, I suspect that only2/ 3 clubs have the money at present to virtually guarantee a top4 finish and Arsenal isn’t one of them, so there will be occasions with him and any other future manager that we will have to contend with what RA and the oil money has brought to the league which completely changed the face of football as I knew it. It’s all about money and the Saudi league is just another example of the way it is going
I’m grateful that I grew up watching first division football when it really felt that at the start of the season that we were in with a chance. There was occasional dominance particularly by Liverpool as an example, but there was also a variety rather than what has happened in recent times. I could also turn up to a game with my parents or a friend. By the time my boys were old enough to go with me in the early 90’s it was all change.
I would like to think Sue P that with this transfer window’s, net spend, added on to that of the last two years ours is one of the clubs that should be up there challenging for the title and looking at Champion’s League football as a consolation prize.
Without question Joe.S as Arteta has been strongly backed. The top2 really should be a minimum standard this coming season. The ‘higher-ups’ see a winner and so do I. That was what impressed me and kept me behind him when things got a bit wobbly at times.
We all believed and do believe that wenger was not given the financial backing like Arteta:
But I found some quotes:
In 2005:
Arsenal chairman Peter Hill-Wood has said there is money available for Arsene Wenger to bolster his injury-hit squad if the Frenchman can find the right targets. Rumours had surfaced that the Arsenal board refused three requests from Wenger to strengthen his squad during the transfer window. Hill-Wood told a newspaper: “That’s absolute nonsense, Arsene was offered money. “But he said he wasn’t going to buy for the sake of it and would only act if he could find someone to add to the team.” Hill-Wood was also keen to stress that the financial burden of the £357million new stadium is not hampering the Gunners in the transfer market. “It is important to say that the new stadium finance does not impinge on him at all,” he said. “The cash is totally separate and it is not affecting our ability to buy new players at all.”
In 2008:
Speaking at Friday’s Champions League draw
Danny Fiszman, the power broker on the Arsenal board, said: “We’ve never said no to Arsene so I’m sure that, whoever he wishes to bring in, he will be fully supported.
“There’s no set amount. But as I said we’ve always supported Arsene, we’ve never said no to him and have no intention of saying no to him.
“I think Arsene said it’s not a big name we’re after, it’s a big talent. I think it’s about big talents and committed players.
“You say we don’t pay the wages other teams do. If you look at our total wage costs you’ll see they’re virtually the same as Manchester United and substantially more than Liverpool.
“Of course we’re all a little less than Chelsea who are in a world of their own. But compared to Manchester United and Liverpool we’re good payers.
“We believe it’s a team sport and we do well but we don’t want the disparity between the top-earner and the bottom-earner being too big. It takes 11 people on the pitch to deliver.”
In 2009:
After record profit.
“There is money to spend but at the moment I am very happy with the squad I have,” said Wenger. “It’s not because I’m against spending money; I have nothing against spending money. It is not a personal thing, it is just that I have a squad that is strong enough to compete.”
“I do not spend money because out of tomorrow’s squad is [Samir] Nasri, [Theo] Walcott, [Nicklas] Bendtner. And people want me to buy strikers, but where do I put them? I don’t know. I have to then lose players who, for me, are world class.”
“I am very happy with the squad I have,” Wenger concluded. “If in December we need to buy someone to add to the squad, I will do it.”
November 2009
You can see in sport that a manager is always under pressure to buy because to buy reassures people,” Wenger said.
“I am always insisting that in our job you should live with your resources, because it is always defendable that you make money if it is linked to the income you earn inside the club, it is not anymore if it is not linked to the income made inside the club.
“There is never too much money, what is important about the money is the way you use it. Ideally you want everybody to have a lot of money available but the danger comes with the way you use it.
“It has always been the reality here and that’s always why I have always defended so much the way we live, the way we play and the way we manage.
“We have a different view because we try to integrate the players after they have worked hard into the first team. And this job requires special people but it demands as well a special force to give a chance to young players.”
In 2011:
“I’m not against spending money if the players we buy improve our squad.
“We must find them and we’re looking very hard, believe me. We have a very big squad and if some players leave we’ll try to bring others in.
“We request top quality. We’re not scared to spend money, don’t worry, but we want to know what we’re getting for it. If you look at the quality of the players I’ve brought to the club you’ll see I’ve not done too badly.”
In 2012
After £150 million sponsorship deal.
Wenger acknowledged he now has serious cash when he said: “Of course. But football is more than just splashing out. It’s much deeper, much bigger than that. It’s about sweat, thinking, working hard.
“You have a big tradition of that in England. I believe the pride of this country historically is built on that. It’s what makes this football strong and interesting. If you go to Nottingham Forest they have won the league. If you go to Aston Villa they have won the league.”
“That means historically this country has always been about effort and thinking about the game. I am scared these qualities have less importance in the game today. It (our philosophy) won’t change. It doesn’t mean we will not spend money. I am always painted like a guy who refuses to spend money, like a greedy guy, and people who live with me can tell you that.
“But I just think I act like a responsible manager because we went through a period where we had restricted funds and I acted in a responsible way. We want to be the best. But the best is not only about buying players. We need to continue with what has made our strengths until now.”
In 2013
Fan Question and answer seasion.
Club Chief excutive Gazidis on the upcoming sponsership deals.
“It is a big summer. We have been working very, very hard to gain the kind of financial capability we need as a football club to be at the very top end of the game,” he said. “Those long term commercial deals have come up for renewal. You know about the Emirates (stadium and sponsorship) deal, I can’t talk about the (new) kit deal yet, but we’re confident of a good result there too.
“It is all about giving us the capability to go to the manager and to say ‘here is the money for you to compete’. That is why we are in this stadium and that is what we want to do.”
“It is no secret that we think he (Wenger) has done a fantastic job and we think we can give him the tools he needs,” said Gazidis.
“When we are thinking about trusting someone with the type of money we will have, we can think of nobody better than Arsene.”
“He is not scared to spend money, but he has to believe he is getting a top-class player.
“The parameters in which he has to operate is to spend what the club can afford and my job is to make that as big as possible and Arsene’s job is to think about which talent he wants to spend that on in the best way possible.
“If we only find one player that we like, we won’t spend twice as much on him just so we can say we spent all of the money. That doesn’t make any sense to me – the key will be to buy the players Arsene Wenger believes in.”
In 2014:
Wenger said: “I’ve said that many times, without any doubt: if we find the right player we will do [a deal].
“There’s a huge difference between the perception that people have of me: I’m not scared to spend money.
“It was periods where we had not the money. What I don’t like is to spend the money I haven’t got. What I fought against is to spend money that would put the future of the club in danger. Now I have money. No problem at all.”
March 2016
He said: “I think if we want to buy at the end of the season, money will be available.
“But the money before the end of the season will not help us.”
August 2016
After Saturday’s 0-0 Premier League draw at champions Leicester City, but the visiting supporters made their displeasure plain by chanting: “Spend some money!”
Asked by a reporter after the game why he was reluctant to part with the club’s cash, Wenger replied: “Why do you say I’m reluctant? I don’t understand that.
“If I buy you tomorrow for 45 million, I’ve spent 45 million. Have I done well, yes? If I listen to you, I will have done well, because I have spent the money. But spending the money in itself is not a quality.
“Spending the money and buying a top player, that is different. We are ready to do that. I spend 300 million if I find the player, if I have the 300 million.
“I have not to forget as well that we are a club who has 600 employees who we need to have a responsible attitude as well.
“It’s a bit surprising that you come out of football games, you don’t speak about football. You have to speak about money.
“I believe that you have to respect the players who have played, the performance that has been done today by those teams.
“If we can find players who can strengthen our team, we are not reluctant to spend the money.”
Etc etc…
Goonster, very good post 👏👏
Goonster
great piece but most of the people you quoted sold us out, took the money and ran.
the biggest downfall for AW was he looked after the clubs money as his own. he wanted us to have a sustainable club which we were but we failed to compete at time due to this.
as far as i am aware he has never said anything detrimental towards the people you mentioned and has always maintained his ethics and decency even though when asked you know there was a underline problem surround individuals such as Gadizis and co and we all know what we think of Gadizis.
we should have stood him down way before we sacked him which was appealing behaviour by our club management but the question was put “did AW fail to keep up with modern tactics”
which is a firm no
would i take the glory and pain of his reign again.
defiantly a yes because before him we were a mediocre club with mediocre ambitions . AW and DD transformed our club and ambitions between them
AW was much weaker for not having DD and replaced by puppets.
we should be asking the question who got rid of DD as that was what stopped our progression
Why did you feel the need to spend your afternoon finding quotes ?
This is from somebody who said he adores Wenger😂 ,seems you have an alternative motive there buddy .
Laughable post that got a thumbs up from the usual cretins .
I trust Wenger more than any of them. But wasn’t he also part of this narrative that we were constantly fed throughout?
When did he ever come out and protest? But all he did was continue to feed us propaganda. They were all in cahoot.
Wenger and the board member all constantly saying That the money was there to spend. The quotes speak for themselves.. Not once did wenger ever come out during all this time and push back on the club propaganda / narrative. But he often was in lockstep with them, always assuring us that the money was available for him to spend but he did not feel it was that needed..
So how is one supposed to conclude? Not a single individual inside the club from 2005 – 2018 ever refuted the “Arsenal are cash strapped due to the Emirate Stadium debt” narrative that we have been fed all along. But the board members together with Wenger himself often disputed that narrative in public, all equivocally assuring us that the money was available for Wenger to spend. And that it’s wenger that refuses to spend it. Wenger’s own quotes throughout the years cleary show a lot of contradiction.
So either the board and Wenger were all being dishonest, making up stuff, lying in our faces, or were just walking contradictions that can’t be taken seriously on face value..
And about all the other former board members selling us out? Didn’t David D also sell us out like all the other board members?? They are all business individuals that did not get rich because they were so principled.. They all sold their shares for vast sums of £millions, David D included.
Lets stop being biased for DD when he also behaved exactly like all his fellow Arsenal board members. He sold his shares for a massive profit like all the other Board members.
Again, I don’t begrudge any of them. They are business people and Arsenal FC was and is still a business for profit. They all profited. It’s Capitalism. Morality and Capitalism don’t mix.
As I keep saying time and time again, I am not emotionally attached to any individual at Arsenal FC, my relationship is a TRANSACTIONAL one. Give and take, be it Player, manager, Board member, Owner, etc. These are wealthy £Multi millionaire business people that will di what is in their own personal interest. Players will drop us for more money and glory in drop of a hat. Board members will sell up their shares in a blink of an eye if a good offer comes in. An owner will sell up in a heartbeat if the right offer comes up. Look what Wenger during the Qatar world cup, doing propaganda, for their oppressive culture because it was in his self interest keeping his job at FIFA. Pushing back on those that dared to criticise QATAR.
So again, I stopped emotional attachments to celebrities (sports figures) that I don’t know personally long time ago. It only leads to disappointment, emotional stress and despair.
Now I am employ a TRANSACTIONAL RELATIONSHIP. You do well for Arsenal I will praise and back you. You stop performing and I want you out.
I will keep backing Arteta until I start feeling that he has taken us as far as he can take us. Then I would be calling for him step aside and let another person also have a go.
It’s time for my own happiness as an Arsenal fan. We have cuddled and idolised these £multimillionaires for far too long. Now it’s time they started caring about us (Fan’s happiness and interests). We have put their interest above the clubs and our interests for far too long.
Tired of it. 🤞👍
This is really well aligned with my thinking. I will say I get “involved” to an extent with what happens on the pitch – I want them to do well and see the players and manager as human beings, so I just want to see them doing their best. However, it’s important not to become too emotionally invested imo – it’s a game run by big money and behind the scenes that’s a huge part of it. Arsenal is a brand, not a family run business that cares – they just want you to think they do because it makes them more money… I don’t have a problem with that.
“Not once did wenger ever come out during all this time and push back on the club propaganda / narrative. But he often was in lockstep with them”
Yup… Great manager, but he was part of the business as well. A company man – don’t hate him for it – it is what it is.
👏👏
“You say we don’t pay the wages other teams do. If you look at our total wage costs you’ll see they’re virtually the same as Manchester United and substantially more than Liverpool.”
I think this is such an overlooked point – our wage bill was always up near the top, even if we paid less of transfer fees. So we maybe weren’t spending so much less than or rivals as was often made out.
I think this was a big factor in our decline – not sure if you’ve listed it here, but i clearly remember something about wenger imposing a kind of semi parity of wages, even with the more unproven players. For example, I seem to remember song and denilson both being paid around 50k pw at a time when song was one of our best players, and denilson was unreliable to say the least. I think he gave these young players bigger contracts too early for fear of losing them, but they ended up losing their motivation as they thought they’d done enough already, imo.
No other manager at a top club survives 9 years straight without any silverware, which also included a decline in our domestic and European competitions.
After 28 comments, ranging from praise to hostility, from not spending to spending, not one person has answered the question posed – show, in the final PL placings from 2004 onwards, where any club ousted The Arsenal due to AW losing his way and other clubs overtaking him.
It should be a really simple exercise, one looks at the league at the end of each season and identifies the teams that have done just that!!
You are right, it is very simple in fact.
Up until 2004, we’d either win the league or challenge for it, in all of Wenger’s full seasons.
Post 2004, he never won another league title, only managed to finish 2nd twice in those 14 years, on neither occasion putting in a genuine title challenge.
More evidence that Wenger was finished as a manager was that he gave it up after his Arsenal sacking.
Brilliant manager for us, absolute legend, deserves a statue and all the praise in the world, but it’s not disrespectful pointing out his many failures which cost the club dear in the second half of his reign.
Facts are facts! The results speak for themselves.
He gave up after his resignation? Who told you that? How sure are you of that accusation? What a sick thing to say.
Have you thought perhaps he is too old and just wanted to finish his time quietly? Perhaps he couldn’t see himself managing any other club than Arsenal?
Who told me? Wenger himself, by not managing again.
It’s bizarre you say it’s sick? I do not get that at all. I’m just pointing out the truth. A manager that was still interested in the job, would have continued somewhere else, and especially in Wenger’s case as a way of proving his doubters wrong, which is something anyone would want to do after getting the sack.
I have absolutely nothing against him enjoying his retirement from management, and good luck to him!
By the way, Wenger did not resign, he was sacked. He’s even said he didn’t want to go post exit. It was basically you leave, or we’ll have to sack you, and the board gave him that out as to protect his reputation.
I completely agree with your comment aside from
1) the point HH made, which, though a bit hyperbolic (wouldn’t call it sick!?), is correct to point out.
2) we were genuine challengers in 07/08 – I firmly believe that was a brilliant team that failed due to sheer bad luck with eduardo, and a bit of a lack of depth. Wenger put that side together, though, and it was a memorable season for me.
Overall, though, a succinct and accurate answer to the question that gives a nice high level overview of my own understanding of Wenger’s career at arsenal.
Strange, that after doing his research, Ken writes that Chelsea hadn’t won anything in ages before the Russian turned up, when in fact the won the FA Cup in ’97 and ’00, the League Cup in ’98, the CWC and the Super Cup in ’98.
Also about Kroenke and being a self-sufficient club. The Arsenal have always been run that way, even when we were known as the Bank of England club, as we only spent what we made.
There was a very interesting article in yesterday’s Telegraph. An interview with Tim Lewis on the Kroenke’s and The Arsenal. A real eye opener for me, as I was strongly against their ownership of the club.
HD, my research was trying to find the alleged clubs and/or managers who had overtaken AW at the end of each season and I note that you haven’t supplied one as yet.
But thanks for the update on Chelsea… did they nearly go out of business by the way?
As for us being self sufficient before kronkie, you forgot to mention the little matter of the Emirates, the roubles and the oil money, but that’s par for the course.
If you still expected Wenger to challenge for the title under those circumstances, then that’s your perogative.
Ken, yet your research led to post something that wasn’t true about that club based in Fulham, and yes they very nearly did out of business, much like we did just before we moved to Highbury.
Yes, I never mentioned the Emirates, but then again the demolition and rebuilding of the East and West stands at Highbury during the 30’s nor the redevelopment of the Clockend in 88/89 stopped us winning League Titles 😁
Just quote me the costs of the refurbished areas in the 30s and the 88/89 season compared to the cost of the Emirates…. but once again, I see not one example of a club or individual who was able to take advantage of the so called failure by Wenger to keep up with modern tactics.
Try as you may to deflect HD (which I have to admit you are very good at) I still await even one example of the idea that you previously endorsed with such passion 🤔😂
Lest I forget, my research didn’t lead me to post something that wasn’t true, it was my opinion, based on a club that I have no interest in football wise … and I again noticed you didn’t mention the roubles and oil money as part of the overall picture during Wenger’s tenure, par for the course again my friend… now, about those magical modern day thinkers of the game who ousted Arsene Wenger 🤔🤔🤔
Well the cost of rebuilding the East and West Stands was about £180k. Now I can’t compare the rebuilding of those 2 stands to the building of the stadium at Ashburton Grove as I don’t know how much wages and materials were in the 30’s, but we all know they were nowhere near as much as they were in 2004 !
What idea, and by whom, did I previously endorse with passion ?
You may well have no interest in that club (though you do mention them quite a bit), but it would save you being corrected if you did check things before writing an article 😂
Strange that you still haven’t identified one example of Wenger being usurped by forward thinking clubs, managers or coaches.. wasn’t that the assumption that you endorsed?
If you don’t know the cost of each rebuild, why use them as a comparison… wait though, I get it, it’s another deflection 😂👍
Strangely enough, chelsea featured quite heavily in the top four PL stats (after the roubles started pouring in) so they would, I suggest, have to be mentioned along with the other top clubs from 2004 to 2016- The Arsenal, united, liverpool and (after the oil money started pouring in) city… weird that you couldn’t see the connection.
As for correcting me, I’m always happy to be corrected and will acknowledge the fact, unlike those who never did the same when corrected about the length of time Arsene Wenger had to agree to stay at The Arsenal in order for the banks to agree the loans for the Emirates build.
No names, no pack drills, but hey ho such is life, win some lose some.
By the way (and of course) no other Arsenal manager had to do that, not even during those absolutely massive rebuilds that you so diligently brought into the discussion regarding the 30’s and the late 80’s, when I mentioned the Emirates and I’m sure you knew that, but just forgot to mention it.
Such fond memories of the painted on faces covering the north bank work , I wonder why they didn’t incorporate something immense like that during the Emirates build? … but I digress 🤔
Back to the main topic, what about those forward thinking clubs, managers and coaches who, allegedly, overtook Arsene Wenger and caused the club such turmoil, stress and anxiety as we neared top four exit from 2004 onwards.
Found any yet?
Just done a bit of research into the two examples of the Highbury rebuild costs, along with the Emirates cost, using the Bank of England changing valuation calculator.
1930s = £10,534,370
1980s = £20,000,000
2006 = £390,000,000
As the managers in the first two examples weren’t under pressure to sell their top players thereafter, while the manager in 2006 was, I suggest you trying to use the first two as legitimate reasons to explain anything is a red herring and another case of deflection… what do you think?
Did you research what wages were at those times and also the cost of materials ?
Wenger was never under any pressure to sell players, as I’ve posted previously, only 30% of incoming money received from player sales was allowed to be used to help pay the stadium debt, as per the deal with the main lender RBS.
Do you want me to find out the cost of hot dogs as well 😂! 😂!
The figures were the TOTAL cost of the work, so I assume that includes everything, wouldn’t you?
Wenger WAS under pressure to sell players, read his autobiography.
Still no examples of clubs or managers / coaches usurping his failure to adapt I note, but a lot of deflection being put for ward in order to deny it didn’t happen…. as I expected.
The pressure was because the players wanted to leave.
As for reading his autobiography, no thanks, as I couldn’t believe the words of a self confessed liar.
Regarding the price of hot dogs, yes please 👍😁
Wenger was great but AFC were frustrating to watch late in his reign..
I suspect his stubborn personality made for his downfall
Today you have to adapt asap. He didn’t.
Again, all I’m asking kjelli is for you to identify, by a drop in league position, where he didn’t adapt… over to you my friend.
League position is one thing but no-one has mentioned what started to become a very poor record in games against the other top 6 teams especially away from home surely that has something to do with tactics as at various points we were better than(finished higher in the table than each team) but really struggled to amass many wins let alone draws in such games. Head to head record against Mourinho Pep and Klopp was so one-sided not in our favor too.
Worse still, though it probably didn’t happen as much as is remembered, we could get absolutely battered at times. It’s only this season that I haven’t feared being destroyed in big games.
Even when we didn’t get battered, in plenty of those big games, sides had us so figured out, they wouldn’t even bother to play well – they’d just keep us at arms length, get a goal or two and conserve their energy knowing they could control is enough to get a comfortable win – that’s how it felt watching it, anyway! Occasionally we’d turn up and get the win, but more often it would be that way.
Davi you might be correct, but why do the league positions from 2004 until 2016 show that only three other clubs managed to get into the top four, let alone oust Wenger’s side from the top four?
If AW had lost his way, why wasn’t any other club able to knock The Arsenal out of the top four?
Other clubs were far less consistent than us, it’s true. Chelsea and to a lesser extent Liverpool would go from winners/nearly winners to just above mid table. Spurs would jump in and out of top four at times (they almost knocked us out once) – they never aligned to have strong seasons at the same time, really. We were always able to do just enough or a little bit more to make top four.
I can’t say wenger didn’t lose his way, but i do subscribe to the view that no one else could have kept us in the top four so consistently with such a general lack of ambition at the club – he slowed our general decline, but was not really able to reverse it for that reason
I just think it would have been better for us (and certainly for his legacy) if he’d left and we’d had that shock to the system of finishing down the table a lot sooner. That’s what really instigated the recent changes imo – if it wasn’t arteta, they’d have gotten another manager and really backed them because of this. It might not have worked out quite so well, so quickly, but they’d have done it – at least we’d have started trying again.
Now that’s a sensible post that I CAN concur with and I repeat that I also believe Arsene stayed too long and, perhaps his last season DID see him becoming tired, both physically and mentally, with pep, klopp, and the managers from Brighton and the spuds showing him the way.
Ken you have this unhealthy obsession with scraping into the top consistently, and consistently getting out of group in the CL, but here’s the thing, it never led to anything!
Instead of consistent mediocrity, I’d rather seasons like Chelsea and Liverpool were having. Yes they would be poor here and there, but then suddenly win the biggest prizes around, whilst we were doing what? Oh yes, 4th again! Maybe the QF of the CL if we were lucky, before getting dumped out with yet another thrashing!
Davi
I just researched Wengers last 5 seasons at the club from 2013( we bought Ozil) results against the other top 6 clubs and it ain’t pretty reading
2013-2014
Arsenal 2-0 Liverpool
Liverpool 5-1 Arsenal
2014-2015
Arsenal 4-1 Liverpool
Liverpool 2-2 Arsenal
2015-2016
Arsenal 0-0 Liverpool
Liverpool 3-3 Arsenal
2016-2017
Arsenal 3-4 Liverpool
Liverpool 3-1 Arsenal
2017-2018
Liverpool 4-0 Arsenal
Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool
Wins:2 Draws:4 Losses:4
2013-2014
Arsenal 0-0 Chelsea
Chelsea 6-0 Arsenal
2014-2015
Chelsea 2-0 Arsenal
Arsenal 0-0 Chelsea
2015-2016
Chelsea 2-0 Arsenal
Arsenal 0-1 Chelsea
2016-2017
Arsenal 3-0 Chelsea
Chelsea 3-1 Arsenal
2017-2018
Chelsea 0-0 Arsenal
Arsenal 2-2 Chelsea
Wins:1 draws:4 Losses:5
2013-2014
Manchester City 6-3 Arsenal
Arsenal 1-1 Manchester City
2014-2015
Arsenal 2-2 Manchester City
Manchester City 0-2 Arsenal
2015-2016
Arsenal 2-1 Manchester City
Manchester City 2-2 Arsenal
2016-2017
Manchester City 2-1 Arsenal
Arsenal 2-2 Manchester City
2017-2018
Manchester City 3-1 Arsenal
Arsenal 0-3 Manchester City
Wins:2 Draws:4 Losses:4
2013-2014
Manchester United 1-0 Arsenal
Arsenal 0-0 Manchester United
2014-2015
Arsenal 1-2 Manchester United
Manchester United 1-1 Arsenal
2015-2016
Arsenal 3-0 Manchester United
Manchester United 3-2 Arsenal
2016-2017
Manchester United 1-1 Arsenal
Arsenal 2-0 Manchester United
2017-2018
Arsenal 1-3 Manchester United
Manchester United 2-1 Arsenal
Wins:2 Draws:3 Losses:5
2013-2014
Arsenal 1-0 Tottenham Hotspur
Tottenham Hotspur 0-1 Arsenal
2014-2015
Arsenal 1-1 Tottenham Hotspur
Tottenham Hotspur 2-1 Arsenal
2015-2016
Arsenal 1-1 Tottenham Hotspur
Tottenham Hotspur 2-2 Arsenal
2016-2017
Arsenal 1-1 Tottenham Hotspur
Tottenham Hotspur 2-0 Arsenal
2017-2018
Arsenal 2-0 Tottenham Hotspur
Tottenham Hotspur 1-0 Arsenal
Wins:3 Draws:4 Losses:3
Overall Wins:10 Draws:19 Losses:21
20% win rate
Home record Wins:8 Draws:12 Losses:5
32% win rate
Away record Wins:2 Draws:7 Losses:16
8% win rate
We can all have our opinion on Monsieur Wenger. There is no denying the way he transformed our club from also rans to top club, with his revolutionary diets and practices. His first 10 years were a triumph. His last 10 years was a slow depreciation of what he had built. I believe he was a great motivator and man manager. I also believe he could have done even better in the first 10 years and better in the last 10 ish, if he had been a “coach”. It is no secret he had a go out and play attitude and when it was going wrong, he threw the kitchen sink at it. Which worked in the first half of his tennure. I think the lack of tactical nous caught up with him in the second half of his tennure. He abandoned completely his own philosophy of a dominant midfield and lightning attacks that served him and Fergie well and went all Barcelona. He tried to copy the tika taka style of Barcelona and with bargain buys that didn’t work. While he often bought excellent strikers and skillful midfielders, he bought some pretty dodgy defenders, which didn’t help one little bit. I always felt he neglected his defence compared to attacking and he paid for it. I dont think i know any manager at the top of his game get so many embarrassing scorelines that he got. I loved the guy but he stayed in the job too long and it caught up with him and kicked him well and truly in the gonads. Fergie left at the right time, Wenger stayed too long. Fergie could see his time coming to an end Wenger couldn’t. The guy is getting his statue and for what he did, it is only fitting. He just stayed on too long and set us back. Which was a shame after the wonderful times he gave us.
That is the most fitting post I have ever read on here. You nailed it.
Sue, it isn’t knocking the guy, it is my own opinion of what i thought and think. He obviously bought some stinking strikers and midfielders and some good defenders but that how i saw it. I never looked at Wenger as a great coach but he was a great manager. I just think unlike the legends in the game, Fergie, Pep and the like were/are both. Thats why they won the CL, when they should of and Wenger didn’t. The team of invincibles, should have won the league two years on the trot and should have won the CL. It didn’t. But he still acieved wonderful things, when he was in his pomp.
Yes he did achieve wonderful things in his pomp.
Reggie, as you know, I always respect your views and comments.
What you say can be discussed and mulled over and, I believe, there would be some really good points of views.
However, the point I’m trying to counteract by using PL stats and facts, is that the claim that Wenger lost his way and was overtaken by more modern thinkers cannot be correct and/or verified.
No matter how many quotes are provided regarding transfer money, or how we didn’t compete for the title etc etc the claim that Wenger was overtaken by younger thinkers of the game, judged on results and final placings from 2004 until 2016 is wrong.
I believe he was over taken ken, all top sportsman are eventually.
The fact ( ok my fact ) he wasn’t the best coach, caught him up early when just being a great manager wasn’t enough.
When i say coach, i especially mean tactical coach.
But still no factual examples to the articles statement and question Reggie.
I have supplied the PL finishes, with the other clubs in the top four… the pattern shows the same clubs season after season after season (with just three individual club exceptions) up until his last two seasons, yet no one has given me one example of an individual club or individual ousting him, as was the claim, due to him becoming dated in his thoughts.
Yes ken you did but his standards dropped and you show that in your examples from the first ten to the second 11. We finished top 2 regularly and then that became top 4, until his last seasons that ultimately ended up dropping out the top four.
👍👍👍
I agree with you about him going Barcelona-esque when he should have stuck to his own style of play.
But IGL, he’s been accused of NOT changing his style, of being stuck in past and being overtaken by more progressive thinking managers / coaches.
Did he stick or twist, did he spend money or didn’t he, did he consistently over perform or didn’t he?
For Ken
I don’t think he has been accused of never changing but not changing his style for specific opponents. Wenger has been accused of having one style and personnel for at least a whole season if not more.
SAF and many others used to constantly change depending on the opponent in a more pragmatic way. I would say AW was more idealistic which was to his detriment. On the positive side he was more principled. So a double edged sword.
Ken, the main stat that counts relates to winning titles and being best in your league Arsene Wegner gave Arsenal fans some of our best years as supporters. He took us from a club which was sometimes justifiably renown for it’s boring football to one which was envied for style, innovation and also winning. However that was then. The last six years of his tenure was one of standing still. Yes, we we on three FA cups, ( they can’t take that away from us ), the football remained stylish and we were consistently thereabouts, although so far. Even Leicester easily beat us to the title. I don’t see how you could still insist that the club were in a good place at the time of his ” stepping aside”. What did he leave for the new manager? Kudos to Wegner for doing a decent job with the cards he had been dealt but also Kudos to his replacements for halting the decline and getting in with what has been a painful rebuild.
Joe, S
Can I suggest that you look at the last four years of seeing Wenger’s squad qualify for the CL and then try to square it with your “the last six years of his tenure was standing still?”
We finished 4th, 4th, 3rd, 2nd meanwhile winning two fa cups. Is that REALLY standing still?
I would also ask you to consider this :
He missed out on yet another CL spot by just one point in his penultimate year and won his 7th fa cup.
Now, if you believe that these results show a man who has not kept up with modern day football in the hardest league in europe, then we must agree to differ.
As for what he left for his successors – UE finished 5th and got to a european final, while MA, in his first season, won the fa cup and charity shield.
By the way, “even Leicester” easily beat city, united, liverpool and chelsea (all known as part of the top four) and, of course, we also, using your terminology, “easily beat them” as well.
Yeh, yeh, Ken I was around , 2 -8 at Old Trafford, saw Van Persie leave, saw Czech arrive as the only signing on the spin that he was worth X amount of points, then a title to be faught over which we limply handed to Leicester after we took six points from them, downhill from there after being humiliated year after year by Bayern or Barcelona in Champion’s League. What did Wegner leave behind? Mustafi, Captain Kos, Xhaka and Elneny? The following year the new people were so desperate that they signed Sokratis, a washed up Swiss fullback on a free transfer and thrust a young inexperienced Gaundouzi into the lions den without having anyone around of worth to guide him. Yes, Wegner was dealt a poor hand but he was also a willing participant in acting as the good cop in the Kroenke’s and Gazadis’ “project”.
What a day, have never seen so many ranting since a certain fan mysteriously gone missing.
“Only five of those clubs have been in the PL since its formation, The Arsenal, Man Utd, Chelsea, Liverpool and the spuds.”
What about Everton?? They are the second longest serving club in the top flight, behind the Arsenal.
If you read the posts above, you will see that this fact has already been pointed out and agreed, by me, as an error on my part.
Thanks for pointing it out though.
Did Arsene need to stay? Of course he did. He stayed as part of deal involving the loan to build the stadium. Once paid off earlier than projected, he did stay for a couple of seasons until the club finds a suitable replacement. Not only Arsene Wenger should be commanded for his intelligence but also his character. He basically sacrificed 10 years of his life guaranteeing the club from debt trap or relegation. Now we are the best run club in England. No sugar daddies, competing for titles and family oriented organisation.
Beautifullly put Mike Ram.
So in what year did Wenger sign that 5 year contract ?
Read the title and immediately knew who the author would be. Scrolled to the end and confirmed. Didn’t read the article as it would be another staunch refusal to accept facts.
What FACTS are they then CG?
Having read all the comments on this thread, its abundantly clear Arsne Wenger was love, respected and appreciated by a great deal of Arsenal fans base.
There seems to be a general consensus that he had stayed on a little too long, I personally think he should have thrown in the towel in 2014.
But in retrospect quitting is vilified as the worst thing one could ever do, as the mark of failure and shame, a sign of weaknes and as the last possible option in nearly any situation, but especially in the sporting arena.
But Arsne Wenger has done awesomely well and there is awfully lot for us to thank him for.
Amen to that Gunsmoke. Nobody above would deny that Arsene Wegner was the best think that happened to Arsenal since Herbert Chapman with a nod of respect towards George Graham. Now! it’s just four more weeks before we see this year’s model in action.
How about Bertie Mee ? Surely he deserves a mention, being that we won our first European trophy and Double under him ?
Afree completely HD, not just a mention either, but an acknowledgement of what he achieved.
You has to be at the ground that night his team clinched the title… it was the moment, along with the cup final win, that really begun our North London dominance in the era of me supporting the club.
I personally rate Bertie’s double as THE most significant of all.
The overall reality is, that in the first part of his tenure, Wenger was a great manager, and for me he is the greatest manager we have had.
But it is also a reality, that in his later years, clubs like Tottenham and especially Liverpool managed to overtake us despite spending far less. The conclusion for me, is they had mangers with new modern tactics, especially pressing, which Wenger never came to terms with.
I believe, he has himself admitted, he should have left some years before he was let go.
I believe, it would have been better for both him and Arsenal, but that is all hypothetical.
3 Epl tittles in 22 years is not the best of records considering he spent his entire time in the Epl in one club, he didn’t do well in terms of players recruitment to aid his time as a manger.