Which generation of Arsenal fan are you?
asks Gurjit
It’s been a while since I have been on this forum, as reading more about the current state of our club after enduring a tough season did not sound particularly appealing to me. I did however read some comments which made me, as a younger Arsenal fan who has only experienced Wenger’s years, think.
Arsenal for me has always been a club which has played the best football in the league and has had a little something that just makes us seem a class above. Over the last few seasons this has changed drastically, starting with our style of play and the way in which we have conducted ourselves, both with redundancies and with the treatment of players (Ozil, Saliba etc).
It’s easy to see how this jarring change in the identity of our club can be difficult to process and lead to a lot of resentment towards those in charge. This leads me on to some of the comments I have seen – many members of this forum have seen Arsenal in many stages and over many years, whilst this certainly would allow someone to take a step back and not stress as much about where we are now, it certainly does not mean that anyone who expresses a view different to theirs, that the current state of the club is unacceptable is just someone young, who has no patience and is a glory hunter.
Patience of course is key for a club in transition and in the same vain there are certainly many on here that are unable to see past “next season” to look at how the club needs to progress and are unwilling to accept that positive change with a strong foundation takes time. That’s not to say that it is unreasonable to have run out of patience with the choices made by the club over several seasons now.
We are not the only club who have had to go through this, we are not uniquely in a worse position than other clubs. Man Utd’s league performances have not suffered as much as ours whilst having gone through a similar change – you could even argue the perpetual change and transfers at Chelsea is far worse for any manager that comes in to deal with, than what has happened at Arsenal.
As I see it we should all be glory hunters regardless of however long we have supported Arsenal. I want the best for the club and personally I’m not keen on the huge variety of views that make this a fantastic forum being put down, based on how long we have supported the club. We all love the club, which is why we are on here in the first place and we all want the best for Arsenal.
So let me ask you a few questions, fans of all generations (please answer in the comments below and feel free to add how long you have supported Arsenal):
At the point at which Wenger left how many years did you expect to wait for us to be a title challenging side again?
Are you content/happy/disappointed where the club is now, compared to where you felt it should be at this point?
Does the clubs leadership have your support (excluding owners)?
How much time would you give the current leadership from this point to get to where you think we should be?
Gurjit
I’m an oldie and a supporter since the 60’s
Once upon a time I was dynamic, wanting everything right here and now but as the years press on, outlooks change from life’s experiences and that much used word regarding Arsenal’s situation – patience- comes into play
It never occurred to me that we wouldn’t be in the top4- even at my age and it hurts a lot that the slide began to the state we are in now
Such was the poor recruitment at the highest level this then followed on the pitch
The owner chooses the top brass and this includes the managers since his ownership. A very rum situation indeed has followed. Post Wenger the club should have reached for the stars in attracting a top coach. unfortunately didn’t work as it should under Emery and a beginner on the management path got his chance rather than going all out to get the best and to make being Arsenal manager appealing. This would have got the players to come to Arsenal
As I can’t see a change of direction by the owner then I think winning anything substantial will take a long time. Even if Arteta does well next season there are other clubs in a much healthier position who will attain more
Ozil Sanchez cazorla Giroud forever
I grew up in Dublin in the 70’s where nearly everyone supported Liverpool or United, i picked liverpool, so watching the 79 cup final at the age of 7 i was supporting arsenal as i didnt want to see united win.. but the way Arsenal played that day and finding out about the Irish connection that day too, there was only one team for me from then on..
89 v Liverpool will always live on in my memory as i was the only arsenal fan in a pub of liverpool fans.. . It was up for grabs alright 😂
Hard to pick my favourite team over the years as we had yeah the invincibles and some fantastic players there but for me its the brilliant performances from individuals that i remember most… very big Dennis and Henry fan, rocky, Merson, Parlour and the great liam brady who played football when the pitches were a disaster..
Bullshit SueP
You are entitled to your view but you need to qualify it
An interesting article that demands an answer from me personally, as it is plain to me and probably to some others that my regular posts are some of which Gurjit is speaking. Even my exact phrases are used, so I know he has me in mind, as well as others, obviously.
First thing to say is that there was SOME attempt at generation balance and that was welcome; just not nearly enough however, for my liking.
I completel disagree with Gurjits view that we are all entitled to be glory hunters, which is my own biggest contention with so many young fans who do not see things this way.
When I mention balance, I have to admit it is difficult, in fact almost impossible for a young fan like Gurjit to know what life in general – not football specifically but life itself – was like in the world in which we oldies in Britain grew up. In our childhood days we had massively less choice in almost every life area than todays young fans have. We had far stricter standards of expected behaviour, which was both useful but also restricive. I grew up in a Britain that was mostly white and essentially racist throughout.
As an early life would be intellecual with a private education, I was always a deep thinker and very analytical from a very early age. I could read like an adult at eight , in fact better than most adults and thus I personally was very lucky.
Even aged twelve, I could clearly see how deeply unfair society was and for the millions who had not the luck and privilege I had, life was often desperate. If you were in a defined minority, ie ethnic, gay, disabled, etc etc, life was massively less compassionate than now, IN GENERAL.
Adult females could not apply for a mortgage without a man signing the deed. Imagine that! How Neanderthal could society be!
But, we had strict standards of behaviour and it was enforced in general and there was physical punishment if you pushed boundaries too far.
HOWEVER, we had freedom, in many cases, in OTHER ways, that todays generation cannot possibly be expected to comprehend.
Being, as we were, not tied down and enslaved by the forces of commercial, materialism, by technology, fashion,computers, mobile phones, social media,illiberal “wokery,” masquerading as proper liberalism, etc etc. We had OTHER freedoms and those were, in my mature opinion , far more beneficial in totality than the ones todays kids have, EXCEPT for the more enlightened social attitudes now.
That bigotry back then, which sadly still exists with the Neanderthal few, has been my life long enemy and fighting it is to me far more important than any mere football club can ever be.
That is not to diss our great club in any way but merely to state honestly and clearly , where I as an older and mature human being base my life priorities.
I could write a great deal more on how life is so different today from way back then. BUT my REASON for this diatribe so far , is just to point out how polar opposite are the attitudes of so many older fans as against younger fans.
I began watching Arsenal regularly in 1958 and we went 12 years before winning an honour (The inter city fairs cup, in 1970). There was no self entitlement by Gunners, not Gooners , back then and we never seriously challenged at the very top of the old Division One until winning the League and FA cup Double in 1971. When our manager BilLy Wright was sacked in 1966, we finished, I think, 13th or 14th.
He had been a below par manager for four years before the fans finally turned and he was sacked. MA, on the other hand has been here just 18 months and won either 1 or 2 honours already , dependant on how you view the Community Shield.
Yet the majority of fans on JA actively want him sacked and SOME of those say so daily, even several times daily. There is no way I can accept that level of self entitlement, that is born from both the general way life is today, coupled with the hugely fan spoilt glory era of AW.
I firmly believe my own life values are more grounded, more real and more honest than some of the constant near hysteria I read daily on this site. Nuff said, for now.
You are completely correct about the self entitlement within the younger generation. My grandma came here in the 50’s and recently had a stroke. She only ever says good things about the NHS etc. whereas those born here, and that of a younger generation tend to complain and whine than really understand how privileged they are in the grand scheme of things.
I’m certain this comes out in the way many fans behave towards the club but that’s not to say we are all the same and feel we are entitled glory hunters.
I say glory hunters in that I want the club to be its best. Everyone does and wants Arsenal to be what we know it can be. I think that is the key here for me that many fans both young and old are not happy with many of the decisions that have been made and have therefore lost trust.
It is and should be uncomfortable to see something you love go in this direction.
And yes you are correct, I have seen your posts in the past though I was as much interested in writing this article due to those who show impatience.
I see you chose not to answer the questions at the end of the article.
Thanks for the thinking reply and for the most welcome fact that we have another literate and deeply thinking fan on here in you!
I would not worry that I chose not to answer your questions if I were you Gurgit. No disrespect intended. I always go my own way when writing and discuss the points I wish to address,which I did, and almost always ignore those which do not fit the REAL substance of the discussion I wish to have.
I am my own man and will always give my honest opinion on the things that most interest me. I both praise and criticise the very same article writers, in different articles, in my perennial quest for the honesty I seek.
PLEASE WRITE AGAIN SOON, as I much enjoyed your article, despite disagreeing with SOME of your points.
Finally, perhaps we view the term “glory hunters” in different ways!
Wow!
We have no way of knowing Ausgooner’s age but his and jon fox’s postings could not illustrate the extremely different people we read on here any better
Meanwhile, nice attempt to come up with something refreshing Gurjit and good post SueP
I’m glad you didn’t think it was BS Fingers Furnell. A name I remember from days gone by😉
My ex wife fantasised over Furnell in a pair of cowboy boots would you believe🤣
Blimey!
Q: At the point at which Wenger left how many years did you expect to wait for us to be a title challenging side again?
A: Five years, because even Man United can’t get another major title eight years after Ferguson’s departure
Q: Are you content/happy/disappointed where the club is now, compared to where you felt it should be at this point?
A: Disappointed with the season results, but I’m happy with the way we play in 2021. If you don’t understand how to assess open play and the potential of a team, compare how Italy and Netherlands play in Euro
Q: Does the clubs leadership have your support (excluding owners)?
A: Yes, because I still hope Kroenke would get more involved. He’s given us 300+ M squad and I heard we borrow money from Barclay to buy some English players this summer
Q: How much time would you give the current leadership from this point to get to where you think we should be?
A: Two years, if Arteta stays and is given the budget to build his own team
Q: At the point at which Wenger left how many years did you expect to wait for us to be a title challenging side again?
A: Immediately. Top 4 under Wenger was not good enough so his departure meant the club was seeking to do better than 4th. The trophy is the only thing better than 4th. 3 years later and even 4th has become a dream.
Q: Are you content/happy/disappointed where the club is now, compared to where you felt it should be at this point?
A: Extremely disappointed. I am witnessing the fall of Arsenal and I won’t cheer for it. No Sir!
Q: Does the clubs leadership have your support (excluding owners)?
A: What leadership?
Q: How much time would you give the current leadership from this point to get to where you think we should be?
A: They already had enough time and all they showed is they have no idea what they are doing. There should have been improvement by now but they have done the opposite.
You’d give him another 2 years? I thought you said that you’d give him till the end of the year.
If Arteta can bring us to top six in the end of next season
While age has been mentioned in a lot of posts by some of old gooners to justify their comment as more wise that is not the fact. While age and experience is important but that is not all you need to be wise. Young people have new ideas, they are more hungary for success, they are more driven while old people are reluctant to change and don’t like taking risks. Plus football has changed so much that dare I say most of the 50-60 years football experience has no impact on understanding the game better. Things have moved on and developed quickly in the world while older generation tend to lag behind or still stick with idiology of past. Cons of being young you are less calculative and some times in your over enthusiasm become reckless so just to close the statement being wise and understanding the game better can not be fenced with which age group you belong to.
I’m more slovakia for success as a younger gooner.
Gurjit, a thought provoking article that deserves a lot of credit for your time and effort.
Firstly, let me answer your questions directly.
1. I thought we would be a top four club, winning cups and playing European football for many years to come.
The youth policy had started to reap benefits AND UE proved that the squad was good enough… missing out on the the CL by one point and losing a European final (all his fault of course).
2. This question, frankly, is a non starter – every fan should be disappointed!!!
3. Yes… a new season needs the fans to back the club.
4. This season in its entirety, in order to see what improvements have been made.
Now on to your broader points and where, it seems, you are coming from.
I have never held the belief that age is, somehow, a factor in deciding one’s views on football and our club’s performance /achievements.
Why?
We all start playing / watching / learning from a very early age and it doesn’t need anything more to judge performances etc etc etc.
Where I believe I am very lucky though, is that I have seen and supported my club through the good and bad times…the “bad” times being something that you will never have experienced as you state that AW was when you started supporting the club.
That doesn’t make me a better/worse/more intelligent wiser fan than you, but it does give me the patience and understanding that EVERY club goes through those times of despair and ecstasy.
I asked a fellow Gooner what he considered the better season, one where we finished with CL football or one where we won the fa cup and he answered that the latter was the better season…. surely we can all see now, that that was wrong and being a trophy hunting fan is not the answer?
Finally, your “hint” that the older fan tends to be dismissive of the younger fan – what is it that we all want?
I have been dismissed on here as “an old fart”, disloyal because of my stance regarding Ozil and the way the club/certain section of the fans treated him and a “Wenger fanboy” who should leave the club, along with the two mentioned people, because of my views.
These “suggestions” were made by both young and old FELLOW fans!!!!!
So please don’t run away with the idea that any one generation has all the answers – at the end of the day, we ALL want The Arsenal to be the best lub in the world and how we can achieve that has a multitude of differing viewpoints, from both old and young fans.
ken, your point I; losing the Europa League final all Emery’s “fault of course”.
Sarcasm at its finest.
True, I stopped reading and jumped to the comments section after reading “with the treatment of players (Ozil,” which should have read “with the treartment of the club by players (Ozil” The saga is over but the scars are there.
Execpt the fan boy club, all others know of the toxic dressing room and how efficiently Mikel has dealt with it and built a solid foundation for him/successors to rest upon in terms of dicipline, laxity, lethargy, etc. He has not succeded 100% as some slimy moss is still stubornly stuck, I trust Mikel to do the needful.
It is indeed painful to watch players like Ozil, Xhaka, Mustafi, Kolasinac, Elneny, Chamak, Sanogo, Asano, was Wenger on some substance when he made these signings? Thank goodness and Ivan for reliving him of his misery as a modern day AFC manager
I remember Terry Neill and Bruce Rioch’s Arsenal Teams. All those slagging off Arteta might want to look at what we used to have to put up with!
Also the Billy Wright and early Bertie Mee years I might add !!
Exactly Marty – that is what being an older fan brings to the table…. a perspective and comparison of the REALLY good and bad old days.
I can go back one further to George Swindon. Bertie Mee’s successes were only due to Don Howe’s superb coaching skills. In my time we’ve only had Graham and Wenger as great managers.
Unfair on the Bertie Mee/Don Howe combination and underrating the achievement in 1970/71 – a European Fairs Cup and a Division 1 title/FA Cup Double, which broke a long drought and equalled Spurs’ 1960/61 success.
At the time, many of us thought all our Christmases had come at once!
One thing I would argue, is at least those players, when they walked onto the pitch gave their best (even if it wasn’t good enough), played for their own professional pride and the shirt, the badge and the Club.
Arsenal had just finished 17th, the season I started supporting the club.
I never expected to ever see us win the title.
That didn’t affect my love in the slightest.
Starting out with such low expectations only made our success all the sweeter.
The Doubles! The Invincibles! A Champions League final! I’ve seen Arsenal win 10 FA Cups, now.
It has been an incredible journey and beyond my wildest dreams.
I’ve never thought much of bandwagon fans.
I don’t understand people who only start supporting a club when it’s winning everything.
In general, I’ll always think less of Gooners who started supporting the club during the Wenger years. There are exceptions, but too many have a false reality and a cringey sense of self-entitlement.
Because, essentially, they’re bandwagon fans.
👍 As they say in the investment world: “time in the market, not timing the market.”
Through good times and bad.
I started watching Arsenal at 98, because our boy Kanu joined the gunners so all I known is the beautiful slick football of WengerBall. Its hard to stomach our decline but we need to know that life is in circles. I might have been around for long like Mr Fox and SueP but I have seen Liverpool’s decline in 2008 in their coma back in 2018. That’s good TEN years, some clubs took longer. So we should be patient, the real gunners will be back and with a bang too!
I started following arsenal in the year 2000 after watching the highlight of kanu’s hat-trick against chelsea&i have been massively disappointed at the turn of things since wenger left&to answer few of your questions,i have little or no faith that arteta,edu&vinai can turn things for the better because they lost my trust by making questionable signings/team selections&for winning the title,i don’t see us winning anytime soon but i would really love it if i will be proven wrong.
I think some of us older fans tend to realise that football success goes in cycles, you just cannot be at the top all the time, you are going to have peaks and troughs. The likes of MU, Chelsea, Spurs, Man City and a few other big teams have all experienced life out of the top league ( be it pre or post Premier League ) and are now back on top or getting to the top of the cycle again.
Exactly. Football is cyclical. But, younger fans can’t appreciate that, of course, until they’ve experienced a few cycles.
It’s amazing how many clubs have had wee eras over the past 40 years.
Arsenal, Liverpool, Forest, Everton, Leeds, Blackburn, Man U, Chelsea, Man C…
But, not Tottenham.
I’m a semi-plastic fan, as I started supporting Arsenal around 2006, 2007.
I thought we’d be at there around the approaching season, to be honest.
Vinai, Edu, and Arteta I’m very disappointed with. As much as they did inherit a lot of mess, they’ve actually deepened our problem. But to be fair, the club did win more points than in 2019/2020 so maybe there’s hope. They’d have until January if it were up to me.
I don’t think neither of the three can bring us back to glory days. But then again, no manager/CEO would win a title at a kse franchise, unless by chance. A few titles in nhl and msl were Leicesteresque flukes.
As long as satan kranky is the master, we won’t see a League title.
I started supporting 2000 after watching kanu play for Arsenal…
I will never leave Arsenal why should I the truthbis that only the real fans will stay through the storm……
Am a Nigerian there is a high level of courruption in my country by the so called leaders but I CANT CHANGE THE FACT AM NIGERIAN.
COYG